Hillary to Call it Quits

[RecycleMichael]

Wow again! 

The very threat of a UN imposed no-fly zone has caused Gaddafi to issue a cease fire this morning. 

So basically we could have done this 30+ days and thousands of lives ago.

It is nice to know that you are an expert on international negotiations and United Nations decisions. Some times there are many factors involved in these delicate matters.

I guess you were just wanting a new way to bash the President.

[Townsend]

It is nice to know that you are an expert on international negotiations and United Nations decisions. Some times there are many factors involved in these delicate matters.

I guess you were just wanting a new way to bash the President.

He's been the worst prognosticator I've seen in a long time.

[Conan71]

It is nice to know that you are an expert on international negotiations and United Nations decisions. Some times there are many factors involved in these delicate matters.

I guess you were just wanting a new way to bash the President.

Unfortunately it's not just Gaspar.  The world's media seems to be starting to ride the President pretty hard.  We are becoming an even bigger laughingstock for our foreign policy.  At least under the Bush and Cliton administrations, you could count on us to go in and bomb something from an aspirin plant to all out carpet bombing and 10 year conflicts.

There's been too many mixed signals out of Washington.  Apparently, they don't do well in coordinating the company line with this admin.

[Townsend]

Unfortunately it's not just Gaspar.  The world's media seems to be starting to ride the President pretty hard.  We are becoming an even bigger laughingstock for our foreign policy.  At least under the Bush and Cliton administrations, you could count on us to go in and bomb something from an aspirin plant to all out carpet bombing and 10 year conflicts.

There's been too many mixed signals out of Washington.  Apparently, they don't do well in coordinating the company line with this admin.

Imagine the fatwas if the USA did what Gaspar apparently wants.

If our military went in to a Mid-East country again without the cooperation of other mid-East governments then Gaspar would get his wish for more terrorism and Israel in a war.

[we vs us]

"Laughingstock" is pretty extreme.  Obama's dealing with an interesting domestic conundrum:  he's overcommitted already overseas (two expensive and lengthy wars + tsunami/nuclear disaster in Japan -- one of our staunchest allies + low grade insurgency wars in Yemen + pirate patrols + Korean peninsula tensions + all the standard old NATO agreements) and undoubtedly trying to find a way to balance our budget woes and reduced appetite for foreign entanglements with things blowing up in literally every corner of the globe. 

At the same time, a no-fly zone is a much bigger commitment than we think it is.  It ain't just planes flying around bombing things.  In almost every modern instance where one has been implemented, we've ended up with long peacekeeping presence in-country after the NFZ accomplishes what it's meant to accomplish.  There are consequences to what we do, and this a biggie. 

I don't like how slowly Obama's moved in the Mid East, and I think Hillary's been right to push the administration to support the no-fly zone, but at the same time he's been correct overall to insist that what's been organic all along should remain organic.  Tunisia and Egypt (and Bahrain and Libya) are all by the people and for the people, and the more we're overtly involved the more it becomes about us and not about them. 

Finally:  what's up with all the Hillary kremlinology, Gassy?  Either you've got a crush or are reaaaaaally hoping against hope that she'll challenge Obama in 2012.  I appreciate you trying to find more primary choices for me, but overall I'm satisfied with what I've got, thanks.

[Red Arrow]

I'm going to have to cut Obama some slack on Libya.  No matter what we do, the USA cannot win.  If we help the rebels, we are interfering in an internal affair.  If we don't help the rebels, we are supporting a dictator (dick tater?   ).

[custosnox]

And now Gaddafi is pretty much thumbing his nose at the threats.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/19/us-libya-idUSTRE7270JP20110319

(Reuters) - Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi's forces pushed into the rebel-held city of Benghazi on Saturday, defying world demands for an immediate ceasefire and forcing rebels to retreat.

The advance into Libya's second city of 670,000 people appeared to be an attempt to pre-empt Western military intervention which diplomats say will come only after an international meeting on Paris later on Saturday.

A Libyan rebel spokesman said Gaddafi's forces had entered Benghazi while a Reuters witness saw a jet circling over the city shot down and at least one separate explosion near the rebel movement's headquarters in the city.

"They have entered Benghazi from the west. Where are the Western powers? They said they could strike within hours," rebel military spokesman Khalid al-Sayeh told Reuters.

Gaddafi said Western powers had no right to intervene.

"This is injustice, this is clear aggression," government spokesman Mussa Ibrahim quoted Gaddafi as saying in a letter to France, Britain and the United Nations. "You will regret it if you take a step toward interfering in our internal affairs."

The Libyan government blamed the rebels, who it says are members of al Qaeda, for breaking the ceasefire around Benghazi.

As explosions shook Benghazi, rebel fighters said they were being forced to retreat from the outskirts of the city, but later claimed victory after holding back the advance, as they have in other towns they eventually lost to government troops.

"We revolutionaries have taken control of four tanks inside Benghazi. Rebel forces have pushed Gaddafi's forces out of Benghazi," said Nasr al-Kikili, a lawyer who works for the rebel media center in Benghazi, as crowds celebrated by firing guns in the air and parading on top of a tank.

Earlier, an unidentified fighter jet was shot down over Benghazi.

"I saw the plane circle around, come out of the clouds, head toward an apparent target, and then it was hit and went straight down in flames and a huge billow of black smoke went up," Reuters correspondent Angus MacSwan said.

"It seems it was attacking the Benghazi military barracks."

REBEL CITY DOUBTS WEST

Benghazi residents were angry at the West's delay. "Europe and America have sold us out. We have been hearing bombing all night, and they have been doing nothing. Why? we have no one to help us but God," said Hassan Marouf, 58, standing outside the door of his house in Benghazi.

"Us men are not afraid to die, but I have women and children inside and they are crying and in tears. Help us."

The French ambassador to the United Nations said he thought Western powers would not take military action till after the Paris meeting, attended by U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and Arab leaders.

"Everything is ready but the decision is now a political one," said a French government source. "It's clear we have to move quickly."

Clinton, British Prime Minister David Cameron and French President Nicolas Sarkozy met each other ahead of the wider talks, a move which could indicate Western military action may start slightly sooner.

Ambassadors from the 28 NATO states adjourned a meeting in Brussels on Saturday to discuss possible NATO involvement in policing Libyan skies till after the talks in Paris.

Meanwhile, rebels said Libyan jets had bombed the road to Benghazi airport and elsewhere on the outskirts.

"They have just entered Benghazi and they are flanking us with tanks, missiles and mortars," Fathi Abidi, a rebel supporter who works on logistics, said at the western entrance to the city where about three quarters of million people live.

He pointed to a black smoke plume on the city's boundaries.

Inside the city, residents set up make-shift barricades with furniture, benches, road signs and even a barbecue in one case at intervals along main streets. Each barricade was manned by half a dozen rebels, but only about half of those were armed.

Elsewhere in the city, rebels reported skirmishes and strikes by Gaddafi forces.

"Fighter jets bombed the road to the airport and there's been an air strike on the Abu Hadi district on the outskirts," Mohammed Dwo, a hospital worker and a rebel supporter, told Reuters.

"ATTACKS MUST STOP"

Within hours of President Barack Obama saying the terms of a U.N. resolution meant to end fighting in Libya were non-negotiable, his U.N. envoy Susan Rice, asked by CNN whether Gaddafi was in violation of these terms, said: "Yes, he is."

Obama made clear any military action would aim to change conditions across Libya -- rather than just in the rebel-held east -- by calling on Gaddafi's forces to pull back from the western cities of Zawiyah and Misrata as well as from the east.

"All attacks against civilians must stop," Obama said, a day after the U.N. Security Council passed a resolution authorizing international military intervention.

"Gaddafi must stop his troops from advancing on Benghazi, pull them back from Ajdabiya, Misrata and Zawiyah, and establish water, electricity and gas supplies to all areas. Humanitarian assistance must be allowed to reach the people of Libya ...

"Let me be clear, these terms are not negotiable... If Gaddafi does not comply ... the resolution will be enforced through military action."

Libyan government forces fired artillery shells into the rebel-held city of Misrata early and pro-Gaddafi snipers killed two people in the city on Saturday, and water supplies were still cut off, residents said.

(Reporting by Mohammed Abbas and Angus MacSwan in Benghazi, Tom Perry in Cairo, Maria Golovnina and Michael Georgy in Tripoli, Hamid Ould Ahmed and Christian Lowe in Algiers; Writing by Jon Hemming; Editing by Giles Elgood)

[we vs us]

Qaddafi's getting his lumps in before NATO can get its forces revved up.  He may even think he can eliminate the rebels entirely before the NFZ gets implemented.  And he may be right.  The question will then be what are the consequences to Qaddafi if he beats the rebellion?  Do we go to war against him after the fact?

[Townsend]

The French are patrolling Lybian airspace today.

[Townsend]

The USA has fired missiles at Libya.

[Teatownclown]

The price of oil will be up on Monday ....$110 coming.