H.O.W. Foundation

[Red Arrow]

Please know what your talking about before you post.....

That's no fun.

[heironymouspasparagus]

Like you've ever done any gardening??

Ever actually used either plastic OR metal edging?
I thought not, just by the irrelevant comment.

[HoneySuckle]

HOW Foundation was booked solid for a month, and ours is scheduled for May 16. The man I talked to told me they work 7 days a week. I decided even if I decided to do the stuff myself, it would probably be that long, the way things go around here.

I'll have to check into the plastic edging. I was leaning toward the metal, but I may be convinced to change my mind. I know the metal is harder to install, as it does not bend easily, at least the heavy duty type the landscapers use. Since they are not coming for a month, I have time to check it out.

One of the days they're coming is a Sunday.  I need the work done before going out of town.  I'll check around and see what I can find out about the edging, both metal and plastic as well and let you know.

What are you planning on planting?  Any ideas where you'll be buying from?  I was going to visit a few nurseries for ideas but Lowes and HD tend to give 1 year warranty on plants, so may end up buying certain things from them.

[heironymouspasparagus]

Plastic is good because it is cheap.  Will last a while - and a little easier to change configuration - move around.  But when you get to "permanent" setup, the metal will be much tougher and last much longer.

Better yet, dig a 6" wide trench, 3 feet deep and poor it full of cement up to about 4" above ground level.  Last long time.  Easy to edge.  3 foot deep will help (a little) to resist bermuda intrusion.

Honeysuckle,
Check out Southwood nursery, Sanders (way out south) and that one over in Sand Springs - can't remember name right off - any will have much better quality plants (faster start, better long term growth - but can be a little more expensive).  Try to get local grown (Oklahoma) if possible - already acclimated.  Lowes and HD are "throw away" plants to maybe get you through a season or two.

[JohnsonHC]

What kind of work does the HOW Foundation do? We have a big tree in our backyard that needs to be cut down. Is that something they would be able to do or too big of a job?

[Nick Danger]

One of the days they're coming is a Sunday.  I need the work done before going out of town.  I'll check around and see what I can find out about the edging, both metal and plastic as well and let you know.

What are you planning on planting?  Any ideas where you'll be buying from?  I was going to visit a few nurseries for ideas but Lowes and HD tend to give 1 year warranty on plants, so may end up buying certain things from them.

I'm not sure what I'm going to plant yet. We are redoing some of our garden area and turning a portion back into lawn because we (I) have a hard time keeping up with the weeds, mulching, etc of such a large area. I really don't like having a corner lot -- there's just too much to do. I don't even know if the area will get planted this year, because I have so much else on my plate, and don't really like to plant things in the heat of summer, so probably in the fall.

I like Southwood and Sanders best, but I have found some more common plants at Lowe's and HD that are fine. The only ones I lost were from gophers eating the roots.

[Townsend]

The only ones I lost were from gophers eating the roots.

Queue Carl, assistant greenskeeper, jokes.

[Red Arrow]

Queue Carl, assistant greenskeeper, jokes.

Explosives.  Bring on the explosives and I believe it was the 1812 Overture.

[HoneySuckle]

Plastic is good because it is cheap.  Will last a while - and a little easier to change configuration - move around.  But when you get to "permanent" setup, the metal will be much tougher and last much longer.

Better yet, dig a 6" wide trench, 3 feet deep and poor it full of cement up to about 4" above ground level.  Last long time.  Easy to edge.  3 foot deep will help (a little) to resist bermuda intrusion.

Honeysuckle,
Check out Southwood nursery, Sanders (way out south) and that one over in Sand Springs - can't remember name right off - any will have much better quality plants (faster start, better long term growth - but can be a little more expensive).  Try to get local grown (Oklahoma) if possible - already acclimated.  Lowes and HD are "throw away" plants to maybe get you through a season or two.

You're right about locally grown.  I've noticed that some of the plants I got from HD or Lowes do not go past a year or two!  The ones that were locally grown are still growing!  Thanks for the recommendations.  I will check them out this week.

[HoneySuckle]

What kind of work does the HOW Foundation do? We have a big tree in our backyard that needs to be cut down. Is that something they would be able to do or too big of a job?

Call them soon and ask if they can handle this.  I heard from a friend that her mother used them to cut down a tree, but I don't know the size. 

[Breadburner]

Plastic is good because it is cheap.  Will last a while - and a little easier to change configuration - move around.  But when you get to "permanent" setup, the metal will be much tougher and last much longer.

Better yet, dig a 6" wide trench, 3 feet deep and poor it full of cement up to about 4" above ground level.  Last long time.  Easy to edge.  3 foot deep will help (a little) to resist bermuda intrusion.

Honeysuckle,
Check out Southwood nursery, Sanders (way out south) and that one over in Sand Springs - can't remember name right off - any will have much better quality plants (faster start, better long term growth - but can be a little more expensive).  Try to get local grown (Oklahoma) if possible - already acclimated.  Lowes and HD are "throw away" plants to maybe get you through a season or two.

There you go again terrible advice......Concrete is what you would want to pour.....Not to mention the fact 3 feet is to deep by far...

[heironymouspasparagus]

Actually, if you want to keep bermuda out, it better be about 4 feet deep.  3 feet won't quite cut it.

And the better advice would be...??

[HoneySuckle]

I am getting really confused.  One person gives advice and another comes up saying it's bad advice?

What's going on guys?

[heironymouspasparagus]

I think he was saying that concrete border is a bad idea.  It is a really good way to isolate a section of yard but is obscenely expensive.  Plastic or metal will be much better unless you plan to stay there for say, the next 40 years.

You most likely want something that is straightforward to install and has a modest cost.  Both plastic and metal are that.  There are a couple types of plastic I have used in the past; either the long strips (many feet long) with coupling mechanisms.  The other is the narrow pieces (about 1 foot or less) that lock together in pieces.  Both are ok.  They tend to get beat up fairly easily by lawnmowers and weed eaters.  After several years, they will be affected by weathering and become brittle and crack.

Metal is long strips, with means to connect at the ends.  Usually powder coated, but after a few years, they will start to fade some and may get rust spots.  Will last much longer than the plastic.  Not that much difference in difficulty to install between the two.

Helps with either to use your shovel to "cut" a notch in the ground along the path to help 'push' into the ground. 

Use a garden hose to lay out the path you want the border to take.  And remember; straight lines are boring.  Curves add interest and appeal from the street for viewing.  Or from just about any angle of observation.

The big question is and what really makes one or the other the "best": which do you like to look at most??  This is very much a personal preference decision.  I like the looks of both.  The metal gives me fewer maintenance issues, so that gives me a slight bias in that direction.  (I have both in the yard right now.)  If you like the look, you will probably like and be satisfied with either one.

If you get a serious wild hair and know beyond any doubt that you have a garden area that will be unchanged for decades, and you plan to garden there for those decades, then the concrete thing is pretty good.  Can make curves, but the ones that I have implemented are all boxes for veggie gardens.  Takes a lot of work, concrete forms, digging tools, and a serious inclination for heavy self-abuse!  The wall must go down at least 3 feet to get below where bermuda goes and 4 is better.  Above ground, I would say at least 6" to 9" to top.  Can add brick or stone to facade and top for decorative touch if want.  Not what I would be serious about recommending except in very special circumstances.

If you go the concrete path, with some planning, can add fencing supports (pipe).  And if you make it twice the size you really want it to be, you have two sides where one can be used for garden and the other for chickens.  Then reverse locations the next year.  Put the chicken coop in the middle fence line between the two, with doors that open to both sides.


Bread and I snipe at each other from time to time across the board, so this is probably a continuation of that.

[Hoss]

I think he was saying that concrete border is a bad idea.  It is a really good way to isolate a section of yard but is obscenely expensive.  Plastic or metal will be much better unless you plan to stay there for say, the next 40 years.

You most likely want something that is straightforward to install and has a modest cost.  Both plastic and metal are that.  There are a couple types of plastic I have used in the past; either the long strips (many feet long) with coupling mechanisms.  The other is the narrow pieces (about 1 foot or less) that lock together in pieces.  Both are ok.  They tend to get beat up fairly easily by lawnmowers and weed eaters.  After several years, they will be affected by weathering and become brittle and crack.

Metal is long strips, with means to connect at the ends.  Usually powder coated, but after a few years, they will start to fade some and may get rust spots.  Will last much longer than the plastic.  Not that much difference in difficulty to install between the two.

Helps with either to use your shovel to "cut" a notch in the ground along the path to help 'push' into the ground. 

Use a garden hose to lay out the path you want the border to take.  And remember; straight lines are boring.  Curves add interest and appeal from the street for viewing.  Or from just about any angle of observation.

The big question is and what really makes one or the other the "best": which do you like to look at most??  This is very much a personal preference decision.  I like the looks of both.  The metal gives me fewer maintenance issues, so that gives me a slight bias in that direction.  (I have both in the yard right now.)  If you like the look, you will probably like and be satisfied with either one.

If you get a serious wild hair and know beyond any doubt that you have a garden area that will be unchanged for decades, and you plan to garden there for those decades, then the concrete thing is pretty good.  Can make curves, but the ones that I have implemented are all boxes for veggie gardens.  Takes a lot of work, concrete forms, digging tools, and a serious inclination for heavy self-abuse!  The wall must go down at least 3 feet to get below where bermuda goes and 4 is better.  Above ground, I would say at least 6" to 9" to top.  Can add brick or stone to facade and top for decorative touch if want.  Not what I would be serious about recommending except in very special circumstances.

If you go the concrete path, with some planning, can add fencing supports (pipe).  And if you make it twice the size you really want it to be, you have two sides where one can be used for garden and the other for chickens.  Then reverse locations the next year.  Put the chicken coop in the middle fence line between the two, with doors that open to both sides.


Bread and I snipe at each other from time to time across the board, so this is probably a continuation of that.

Might also be his frat buddy has been out of town lately, so he's missing him...