9 Things The Rich Don't Want You To Know About Taxes

[Hoss]

Leave it to Bread....is that your special treatment of corn for making meal in your cornbread??



Conan,
You said you would not be too adverse to a rate hike.  Exactly how much - in percent - would you not be adverse to?  

I will put in a number - I wouldn't object to 3%.  How about it?

Because there's never anything useful for him to add, aside from being AW #2 on here.

[we vs us]

I guess I just don't know how to square it.  We've been giving trickle-down the ole' college try since Bush II's tax cuts, and they've been an utter failure for everyone but the top 1%.  Wages have stayed flat (even without the recession) and no real jobs have been created, even though we've pumped the richest Americans and all of our multinationals full of cash.  That last decade has provided no proof whatsoever that this dynamic actually functions.  In fact, we're seeing with our own eyes that the opposite is true. 

So why, Conan and Red, on god's green earth do you think that doing the same thing we've always done is going to guarantee a different outcome? I get that you don't trust government, but there's even less reason to trust the current dynamic as it stands. 

[Red Arrow]

So why, Conan and Red, on god's green earth do you think that doing the same thing we've always done is going to guarantee a different outcome?

We've been conditioned by using MicroSoft products.   

[guido911]

So why, Conan and Red, on god's green earth do you think that doing the same thing we've always done is going to guarantee a different outcome? I get that you don't trust government, but there's even less reason to trust the current dynamic as it stands.  

We haven't been doing this trickle down thing for the last two years. I guess things around here are wonderful? Right? And I too use microsoft products. Dammit.

[nathanm]

We haven't been doing this trickle down thing for the last two years. I guess things around here are wonderful? Right? And I too use microsoft products. Dammit.

Did I miss a tax increase somewhere, or are you making smile up again?

[guido911]

Did I miss a tax increase somewhere, or are you making smile up again?

You sure did. Also, where in trickle down economics is it espoused that we have trillion dollar stimulus payouts or government healthcare or government motors? I mean, I know those had nothing to do with our deficit/debt. It was all Bush II's tax cuts to the rich.

[nathanm]

You sure did. Also, where in trickle down economics is it espoused that we have trillion dollar stimulus payouts or government healthcare or government motors? I mean, I know those had nothing to do with our deficit/debt. It was all Bush II's tax cuts to the rich.

One time costs do not a structural deficit make. And please enlighten me as to where this income or capital gains tax increase was. And once again, HCR improves the deficit.

[we vs us]

You sure did. Also, where in trickle down economics is it espoused that we have trillion dollar stimulus payouts or government healthcare or government motors? I mean, I know those had nothing to do with our deficit/debt. It was all Bush II's tax cuts to the rich.

None of those things have anything to do with the trickle-down mechanism.  Do you know what trickle-down is?

[nathanm]

Still can't find the tax increase..

[guido911]

Clowns scare me.  Clowns spouting class envyisms absolutely frighten me.

Take comfort (unfortunately sanitized) :

Think of this whenever responding to aox.

[Teatownclown]

I thought you were against tax breaks for big corporations and folks with money to invest.

No. I am against the SCOTUS rule allowing the buying of our (conflict of interest) public deciders by corporations.  Besides, it's just wrong in light of "by the people, of the people, for the people". I am against big corporations that make big mistakes hurting many while barely getting spanked. I dislike profit being a higher goal than protecting the common good.

I am all for folks with money to invest provided they do it with integrity,honesty, and no harm. (Obviously, fluid makers for fraking would be suspect and under tight surveillance as would be nuclear engineers, real estate developers, big pharma .....lots of suspects who need to be oversighted ). Investing is the back bone of our economy. To be against folks with money would be absurd. But those who make an inordinate income (those in the top%4) need to proportionately pay more for the privilege we give them to be able to earn more. Higher taxes do not deter from capitalism but greed.

Hording money at the top hurts the American dream and sucks dry the velocity of money needed to get real unemployment cured. I believe there should be proportionality between corporate tax rates and profit as well. I do not like corporate welfare in any form because I am a true capitalist. Hence, my negativity re: arena's and such over education and clean air and water and crime protection.

So, that's just part of clown reality.  

[guido911]

Still can't find the tax increase..

Here you go.

http://blog.heritage.org/?p=51829

[Teatownclown]

Take comfort (unfortunately sanitized) :

Think of this whenever responding to aox.

Typical Guido....violence in one form or another. Civility is not your calling card.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=guido  A sad pathetic excuse for a male;

[Teatownclown]

Here you go.

http://blog.heritage.org/?p=51829

And for those who forget quickly the Heritage Foundation are bad corporate shills and worse righteous fakes.

Here you go. http://smirkingchimp.com/thread/27128

[Red Arrow]

Since I've got the numbers handy, let's check it out, starting with Eisenhower:

Top Marginal Rate | Average Yearly Job Creation (in thousands)
84.36%                       in 1950, Truman                   
91%               | 765      Truman/Eisenhower/Kennedy
70%               | 2,014    LBJ  ("Kennedy" cuts took effect in 64, JFK was assassinated in Nov 63), Nixon, Ford, Carter, early Reagan
50%               | 1,920    Reagan
28%               | 1,828    Late Reagan, early Bush I
31%               | 147       Bush I, early Clinton
39.6%             | 2,883    Clinton, early Bush II
35%               | 9.625     Bush II, after 2002  39.1% in 2001, 38.6% in 2002

President | Average Monthly Job Creation (in thousands)
Eisenhower| 36.85
Kennedy   | 105.06
Johnson   | 196.5
Nixon     | 137.03
Ford      | 71.48
Carter    | 215.4
Reagan    | 167.73
Bush 41   | 54
Clinton   | 236.92
Bush 43   | 11.4
Obama     | -108.65

Let's keep in mind that Obama's first term is not yet complete, and last year we added 940,000 jobs and this year we're on track for about 2,000,000, for about a 1 million job deficit by the end of the year..pretty good considering his first year in office we lost over 5.1 million jobs, which is by far the highest in any year since the BLS started keeping records. Reagan's 1982 number of 2.1 million lost jobs is the next highest.

Edited to add: RA, here you go http://www.truthandpolitics.org/top-rates.php  Found it, added data above from your link except Presidents names which I remember. (OK, I don't really remember Truman but I do remember Eisenhower.)

Other events will always have an effect. That's why I went back to the 40s 50s. At some point, you have to think it's all averaged out.

Perhaps you guys can now see a little more of why I have more than a little skepticism for the Republican point of view on economics..   Not really

Other factors I can remember:
JFK, LBJ, Nixon: Laos, Cambodia, Viet Nam.  Before 'Nam, we had the crisis in Laos.  The military/industrial complex in full force. First Arab Oil Embargo. (And 55 MPH national speed limit.)

Ford: I had a secure job (US Navy) until Nov of 76.  I didn't watch too much TV or read the paper much.

Carter:  People had lots of $ due to double digit inflation.  Too bad it wasn't worth what it was the day before.  I don't entirely blame Carter though.  Bad timing to be Prez.  I was going to school (TU) on the GI bill and a Teaching Assistant job.  We must have saved a bunch of money on the military.  The Iran hostage situation made us realize our military was not at its peak performance levels.

Reagan: Most of us have various memories of Ron.  He inherited double digit inflation and turned it around in his time.  Yep, my taxes went up.  In 1980 I got a 25% raise just to keep up with starting salaries left over from the inflation.  I got normal raises after that so my taxes continued to climb, as did my spendable income. Federal income went up, just not as fast as spending.

Bush I:  I have to admit that (Read my lips, no new taxes) from 28% to 31% should not have had the massive effect on jobs.

Clinton: Right time, right place.  Republican Congress in 94.  Clinton and Newt did some good compromises. No Hillary Care, Welfare reform.  Even Carter would have done well during the DOT Com bubble. However, toward the end of Clinton's administration, the economy was declining in some sectors.  It was certainly declining in the machine tool manufacturing arena.  I have stated before that I almost voted for AlGore so he would get his just reward for the looming recession.

Bush II:  Might have been successful except for 911.  Spent money like a Democrat.

Obama:  I think taxing the rich will not cover what he wants to spend.