Debt Debate in Congress

[nathanm]

Gaspar, over 600,000 government jobs have gone away in the last two years. (more than that if you count temporary census workers as the high, rather than the business cycle peak) Even the feds are down from their (late, thanks to stimulus) peak by about 30,000 workers.

USPS, which you regularly complain about, is down over 150,000 workers since 2009.

[Conan71]

Gaspar, over 600,000 government jobs have gone away in the last two years. (more than that if you count temporary census workers as the high, rather than the business cycle peak) Even the feds are down from their (late, thanks to stimulus) peak by about 30,000 workers.

USPS, which you regularly complain about, is down over 150,000 workers since 2009.

Where are you getting your stats?

Are those 600,000 all from the federal payroll or state and local as well?  If the feds had sloughed that many jobs, you'd think the White House PR machine would be all over this in trying to prove that under Obama they've gotten serious about cutting government spending.

This article claims 11,666 federal jobs were lost last fiscal year.

"In the budget year that ended on September 30, more than 11,660 government workers were let go. The government employs roughly 2.1 million people."

http://www.job.com/career-advice/employment-news/study-federal-workers-have-exceedingly-high-job-security-with-death-more-likely-than-firing--$438031523-1313.html

[Breadburner]

Gaspar, over 600,000 government jobs have gone away in the last two years. (more than that if you count temporary census workers as the high, rather than the business cycle peak) Even the feds are down from their (late, thanks to stimulus) peak by about 30,000 workers.

USPS, which you regularly complain about, is down over 150,000 workers since 2009.

And the bucking mail is still getting here on time......Whats that tell ya.....

[guido911]

And the bucking mail is still getting here on time......Whats that tell ya.....

Just about all I need to know about this bloated, taxpayer-funded jobs program.

[nathanm]

Where are you getting your stats?

Are those 600,000 all from the federal payroll or state and local as well?  If the feds had sloughed that many jobs, you'd think the White House PR machine would be all over this in trying to prove that under Obama they've gotten serious about cutting government spending.

It's overall government sector employment, which includes state and local governments. I specifically stated the number of federal jobs lost.

And I get it where I get most of my data; by way of FRED, but from the government agencies tasked with collecting it.

[nathanm]

And the bucking mail is still getting here on time......Whats that tell ya.....

It tells me that postal mail volume is down dramatically from its peak around 2000 and that the USPS is continuing to modernize its processes to require fewer employees.

[guido911]

Then why post that point in this thread, Nate? The impression you left was that the debt problem had something to do with it.

[nathanm]

Then why post that point in this thread, Nate? The impression you left was that the debt problem had something to do with it.

To counterbalance Gaspar's rant with the full story. Total government receipts (this includes taxes, fees, seignorage, and everything else) are about 27% of GDP right now. Basically we're right about where we were in the late 60s relative to GDP.

Scary, right? We definitely had big government by the late 60s!

Well, not exactly. Federal receipts are currently standing at 16.5% of GDP, far below the post-WWII average.

[Breadburner]

Then why post that point in this thread, Nate? The impression you left was that the debt problem had something to do with it.

He sure has to bury alot of turds.....

[Townsend]

It actually does have something to do with debt.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20081162-503544.html

The steady loss of revenue has prompted the Postal Service to evaluate possible cost-saving measures. Donahoe said the USPS is on track to miss a Sept. 30 payment of $5.5 billion to the U.S. Treasury that would allow the Uncle Sam to "pre-fund retired health benefits" of postal workers.

I know there will be arguments about this but where else would the funding come from to provide those benefits?  That will increase the debt.

So layoffs, closings of USPS offices, less days of operation.

No idea about the 600,000.

[Conan71]

It's interesting.  A few months ago I was in Donaldson Station at 14th & Terrace Dr. and there was a sign on the wall which said the postal service did not operate on tax payer funds or on tax money, something along those lines.

If they operate at a loss, where do they get funds to keep operating then?

[TulsaMoon]

It's interesting.  A few months ago I was in Donaldson Station at 14th & Terrace Dr. and there was a sign on the wall which said the postal service did not operate on tax payer funds or on tax money, something along those lines.

If they operate at a loss, where do they get funds to keep operating then?

Taxpayers covered 23.3% of postal costs in 1971. A subsidy of that level in 2007 would have been approximately $16.9 billion. But direct subsidies to the USPS were phased out between 1972 and 1982. Today the USPS is funded entirely by revenues from postage.

[Gaspar]

Taxpayers covered 23.3% of postal costs in 1971. A subsidy of that level in 2007 would have been approximately $16.9 billion. But direct subsidies to the USPS were phased out between 1972 and 1982. Today the USPS is funded entirely by revenues from postage.

Now they just lose billions of dollars every year, and don't have to pay it back because they are protected by legislation that lets them borrow from the government at ridiculous rates and continue to borrow.

The year before last their deficit was $7 billion.  They cut 100,000 workers.  Last year's deficit has just been reported at $8.5 billion.

They are government, if not in name, in style!

The ads you are seeing are from the Union.  The post office will have to release several hundred thousand more workers and suspend some routes, and the unions want to get in front of the message.

"Hey, we tried!  We spent millions of your dues to convince the public that you were a money makin machine!"

[nathanm]

Now they just lose billions of dollars every year, and don't have to pay it back because they are protected by legislation that lets them borrow from the government at ridiculous rates and continue to borrow.

Hmm, you do understand the difference between a loan and a gift, right?

[Gaspar]

Hmm, you do understand the difference between a loan and a gift, right?

Shhh!  If you let the union guys hear you call it a gift, you could lose a knee!