Another stab at liquor law reform

[DTowner]

Oklahoma Supreme Court Invalidates Retail Liquor Proposal

http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-supreme-court-invalidates-retail-liquor-proposal

So the grocers were fighting this one?

Yes, this was the one reform proposal out there that might have made things worse than current law.  The Retail Liquor Association initiative would have allowed wine sales in grocery/convenience stores, but would limit the license to just one location (with the possibility to buy up to 3 more licenses from existing package stores, if they found any for sale).  And the wine selling grocery/convenience store could not be located within 2,500 feet of an existing package store.

Many liquor store owners clearly want to preserve their special arrangement and simply do not want to compete in a free market that would benefit the consumer.  Even SJR 68 preserves some of the special protections to liquor store owners, but it is a huge improvement over this initiative and currently law.

Ultimately, the Okla. Supreme Court struck down the initiative because its description on the signature sheet was deceptive - it did not mention the license or footage restrictions.  Seems like the right decision - this initiative was intended to deceive and confuse voters into thinking they were getting real reform.

[Townsend]

Yes, this was the one reform proposal out there that might have made things worse than current law.  The Retail Liquor Association initiative would have allowed wine sales in grocery/convenience stores, but would limit the license to just one location (with the possibility to buy up to 3 more licenses from existing package stores, if they found any for sale).  And the wine selling grocery/convenience store could not be located within 2,500 feet of an existing package store.

Many liquor store owners clearly want to preserve their special arrangement and simply do not want to compete in a free market that would benefit the consumer.  Even SJR 68 preserves some of the special protections to liquor store owners, but it is a huge improvement over this initiative and currently law.

Ultimately, the Okla. Supreme Court struck down the initiative because its description on the signature sheet was deceptive - it did not mention the license or footage restrictions.  Seems like the right decision - this initiative was intended to deceive and confuse voters into thinking they were getting real reform.

Thank you for the clarification

[Red Arrow]

And the wine selling grocery/convenience store could not be located within 2,500 feet of an existing package store.

There are liquor stores closer to each other than that.  The ones that immediately come to mind are The Crossing on the SW corner of 101st and Memorial (in the complex that used to have the Food Pyramid) and Parkhill's South just north of the QT at the NW corner of 101st and Memorial.  Otherwise, there seems to be a liquor store about every mile on Memorial which would make locating a convenience store selling strong beer and wine nearly impossible.  How clever.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

There are liquor stores closer to each other than that.  The ones that immediately come to mind are The Crossing on the SW corner of 101st and Memorial (in the complex that used to have the Food Pyramid) and Parkhill's South just north of the QT at the NW corner of 101st and Memorial.  Otherwise, there seems to be a liquor store about every mile on Memorial which would make locating a convenience store selling strong beer and wine nearly impossible.  How clever.

Growing up there, I remember that it seemed like wherever there was a grocery store, there was a liquor store in the same complex or in the parking lot, like the old McCartney's on Memorial had a liquor store right next to where you drove up to get your groceries. Credit to the grocers for finding that.

[Townsend]

Petition to sell strong beer, wine in grocery stores draws official challenge

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/state/petition-to-sell-strong-beer-wine-in-grocery-stores-draws/article_8c47d7cc-f08c-5b7e-9b79-d0540e96af7e.html

OKLAHOMA CITY — The Retail Liquor Association of Oklahoma on Friday filed a challenge with the Oklahoma Supreme Court to an initiative petition seeking to modernize the state's liquor laws.

The action came after its own initiative petition, State Question 785, was tossed off the ballot Tuesday by the Oklahoma Supreme Court following a challenge by the Oklahoma Grocers Association.

Oklahomans for Consumer Freedom is seeking to circulate an initiative petition to get State Question 789 on the November ballot. It needs 123,725 signatures to amend the state constitution.

The petition would allow strong beer and wine to be sold in grocery and convenience stores. It would allow liquor stores to sell up to 10 percent nonalcoholic items.

Tom Gruber, an attorney for Oklahomans for Consumer Freedom, said he had not seen the challenge and withheld comment.

The challenge says the petition violates the Equal Protection Clause of the U.S. Constitution because it proposes different treatment for similarly situated persons, specifically retail spirits license holders, who can sell spirits, wine and beer, and retail wine and beer license holders, who can sell wine and beer.

The petition also proposes unequal treatment for in-state and out-of-state corporations desiring to hold a wine and spirits wholesalers license, according to the challenge.

It also violates the Equal Protection Clause, according to the challenge, because it limits the number of retail spirits licenses a person may hold and imposes no limit on the number of retail wine and beer license a person may hold.

"Permitting retail wine licensees and beer licensees an unlimited number of licensees unnecessarily, arbitrarily and irrationally discriminates against holders of retail spirits licenses, who are permitted to hold only one license for the sale of wine and beer," the protest said. "Such a restriction on retail spirits license holders would create an inequitable competitive environment due to the rapid influx of retail wine and beer license holders (which would include but not be limited to, grocery stores, pharmacies, convenience stores and supercenters).

"This inequality would unduly threaten the viability of retail spirits licensees who depend on the sale of wine and beer as well as spirits."

The challenge says the petition would limit the sale of items other than alcoholic beverages by liquor stores to no more than 10 percent of monthly sales, but there is no limitation on retail wine and beer license holders as to their sale of other retail items.

The challenge says the description or gist of the petition fails to provide sufficient information about the important and far-reaching changes to state law. In addition, it contains misrepresentations about the content of the proposal, according to the challenge.

The challenge seeks to strike the measure from the ballot.

Recent proposals to change Oklahoma's liquor laws
State Question 783 (Oklahomans for Modern Laws)

• Would allow regular-strength beer capped at 8.99 percent alcohol by volume in grocery and convenience stores.
Status: Petition withdrawn in March after challenges filed.

State Question 785 (Retail Liquor Association of Oklahoma)
• Oklahoma breweries would be able to distribute their products directly to Oklahoma liquor stores.
• Brewers in the state could serve and sell their product at their breweries, regardless of alcohol by volume.
• Would require a distance of at least 2,500 feet between two outlets that sell spirits or wine, but existing stores would be grandfathered in under the proposal.
Status: The Oklahoma Supreme Court invalidated the initiative petition Tuesday.

Senate Joint Resolution 68
• Would include wine and strong beer in groceries and convenience stores.
• Would allow liquor stores to operate two locations
• Would allow Oklahoma liquor stores to have up to 20 percent of their sales come from nonalcoholic items.
• Would allow breweries in the state to operate brew pubs selling full-strength beer.
Status: Currently in a conference committee along with a companion measure, Senate Bill 383, which would change the state's liquor statues.

State Question 789 (Oklahomans for Consumer Freedom)
• Would allow strong beer and wine to be sold in grocery and convenience stores.
• Would allow for liquor stores to sell up to 10 percent nonalcoholic items.
• Backers include large chains including Walmart and QuikTrip.
• Replaces SQ 786, which was withdrawn.
Status: Challenge to initiative petition filed Friday.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

SNAFU. The liquor retailers don't want their monopoly broken up and competition to be the norm. Geeez, ever going to get out of the stone age? Oklahoma liquor retailers, the definition of protectionism.

[heironymouspasparagus]

SNAFU. The liquor retailers don't want their monopoly broken up and competition to be the norm. Geeez, ever going to get out of the stone age? Oklahoma liquor retailers, the definition of protectionism.

Graft.
Corruption.
Political patronage.
Cronyism.
Oklahoma business as usual.

[DTowner]

It is unrealistic to expect liquor stores to support any reasonable modernization of Oklahoma's liquor laws because under any reasonable modernization the liquor stores are going to be the biggest losers.  But that is because the current system is most rigged in their favor:  monopoly on selling high point beer, wine and liquor; equalized wholesale pricing; one-store restriction; no corporate ownership; etc.  I think it is reasonable to assume that lost wine/beer sales at liquor stores will not be made up by sales of sodas, cork screws and other sundry items, and some liquor stores won't make it under a new system.  That is unfortunate for those individual owners, but, like any other business, liquor stores shouldn't get a guaranty of survival from the state.

[Townsend]

Oklahoma Senate OKs Bill Expanding Sale of Strong Beer, Wine

http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-senate-oks-bill-expanding-sale-strong-beer-wine

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — Oklahomans could buy cold strong beer and wine at grocery and convenience stores under a sweeping overhaul of the state's alcohol laws approved by the Senate that hinges on voters approving a state question in November.

The Senate voted 33-12 on Thursday for the 285-page bill by Oklahoma City Republican Stephanie Bice.

The bill allows strong, cold beer and wine to be sold at grocery stores and convenience stores beginning in 2018.

Currently in Oklahoma, strong beer and wine can only be sold in package stores. The bill would also allow package stores to sell products other than alcohol.

The bill is a companion measure to a proposed state question on the November ballot to loosen Oklahoma's alcohol laws.

[Conan71]

Oklahoma Senate OKs Bill Expanding Sale of Strong Beer, Wine

http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-senate-oks-bill-expanding-sale-strong-beer-wine

Now it goes to the unwashed masses who elected the people running our legislature.  I can already picture the ads from fundie groups alleging massive amounts of underage binge drinking and drug use as a result.

[DTowner]

I think the House still has to pass SJR 68 (putting the constitutional changes on the Nov. ballot) and the Senate has to pass SB 383 (making all the statutory changes to implements the modernization).

For what it's worth, polls show the modernization changes to have wide-spread support.  Of course, state polls seem to be particularly unreliable.  While MADD, liquor stores and some religious conservatives will be against it (the modern "Bootlegger & Baptist Coalition"), those groups don't seem to have nearly as much sway on these types of issues that they once did.  If it carries in OKC and Tulsa, it will be hard to defeat it.

[Conan71]

I think the House still has to pass SJR 68 (putting the constitutional changes on the Nov. ballot) and the Senate has to pass SB 383 (making all the statutory changes to implements the modernization).

For what it's worth, polls show the modernization changes to have wide-spread support.  Of course, state polls seem to be particularly unreliable.  While MADD, liquor stores and some religious conservatives will be against it (the modern "Bootlegger & Baptist Coalition"), those groups don't seem to have nearly as much sway on these types of issues that they once did.  If it carries in OKC and Tulsa, it will be hard to defeat it.

Rural Oklahoma kept killing liquor by the drink for years as a state-wide measure.  Never underestimate the fundies who live in the sticks.

[Hoss]

I think the House still has to pass SJR 68 (putting the constitutional changes on the Nov. ballot) and the Senate has to pass SB 383 (making all the statutory changes to implements the modernization).

For what it's worth, polls show the modernization changes to have wide-spread support.  Of course, state polls seem to be particularly unreliable.  While MADD, liquor stores and some religious conservatives will be against it (the modern "Bootlegger & Baptist Coalition"), those groups don't seem to have nearly as much sway on these types of issues that they once did.  If it carries in OKC and Tulsa, it will be hard to defeat it.

I tell you what, in my FB news feed I regularly get posts telling me to contact my representative to pass these bills.  What results in the comments is pure entertainment.  I'm sure trolls for the opposition get on there, because i say comments saying 'it will kill jobs and local liquor stores'...'it will make beer prices jump'.  They're nervous.  I for one am glad to see us incrementally coming into even the 20th century.  This state cracks me up.  People I know from out of state ask me why I still live here.  I tell them, "Don't you know?  Oklahoma!  It's not just OK, it's 'meh'."

[cannon_fodder]

All the desired measures past:

2015 SB 424 - allows breweries to do with strong beer basically everything they can do with low point beer. Brings them close to what wineries can do. Supposedly no vote of the people required, may be challenged on that ground.

2015 SB 383 - the big dog. 285 pages that completely re-writes our liquor laws. Makes a single definition of alcohol, allows sales of cold at liquor stores and of alcohol at gas stations. Still keeps vestiges of the past and adds new quarks. But a huge step in the right direction, requires a vote of the people.

SJR 68 - Abolishes the ABLE commissionn and starts over. This is the ballot measure to which 383 is the companion.

[Hoss]

All the desired measures past:

2015 SB 424 - allows breweries to do with strong beer basically everything they can do with low point beer. Brings them close to what wineries can do. Supposedly no vote of the people required, may be challenged on that ground.

2015 SB 383 - the big dog. 285 pages that completely re-writes our liquor laws. Makes a single definition of alcohol, allows sales of cold at liquor stores and of alcohol at gas stations. Still keeps vestiges of the past and adds new quarks. But a huge step in the right direction, requires a vote of the people.

SJR 68 - Abolishes the ABLE commissionn and starts over. This is the ballot measure to which 383 is the companion.

So these will go to a vote of the people in November?  Or was I wrong when someone said it would just be SJR 68 that goes?

Edit:


OK, never mind.  I read the article in the Whirled, and it says that 68 gets voted on, but if it passes, then 383 goes into effect in 2018.  As you said, 383 is the big dog, as it would redefine how strong beer and liquor is gauged.  Says it would allow grocery stores/convenience stores to sell beer up to 8.99% ABV and wine up to 15%.


424 has to be signed by the governor; I don't think it requires a vote of the people if I read correctly.