Official 2011 Christmas Season vs. Holiday Season

[guido911]

Dried pine needles?

Those too. Cleaning up the mess is all part of it all.

Maybe that's the reason why I get a bit agitated when PC demands interfere with traditions I keep.

[guido911]

And now for the other side of the story

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-biz-1109-christmas-tree-wars-20111109,0,2983619.story

Check the validity of the story when quoting Drudge. 

Jim Demint weighs in on the "stupidest tax of all time".

So why should the government-funded Christmas Tree Promotion Board tax us to fund a marketing campaign?  So the Christmas tree industry can pocket the $2 million they now won't have to spend marketing their trees.

That's it.  That's the whole purpose of the Obama Christmas Tree Tax: to take money from hard-working families celebrating Christmas and give it to clever lobbyists and businessmen running a crony-capitalist subsidy scam.

And while this policy will, by design, help one group of people, it will hurt others: businesses that sell artificial Christmas trees, people who work at your local stores that sell them, and, don't forget, the consumers who are out 15 cents a tree.

Business groups using government connections to enrich themselves by hurting everyone else.  Makes you just want to break into "O Holy Night," doesn't it?

http://demint.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?p=JimsBlog&ContentRecord_id=1b5c048c-3715-44a4-9267-1a547661b9a4

[DTowner]

These agriculture product promotion fees/taxes have always been controversial among the producers, although they are often popular with the trade associations who tend to capture and control the fees ("Beef, what's for diinner" and "Got Milk", etc.).  Everyone probably remembers the "Heard it through the Grapevine" promotion for California rasins in the 1980s.  While the ads were popular and spawned a cottage industry around the rasin charecters, they did very little to increase rasin sales, which was supposed to be the whole point.

[heironymouspasparagus]

These agriculture product promotion fees/taxes have always been controversial among the producers, although they are often popular with the trade associations who tend to capture and control the fees ("Beef, what's for diinner" and "Got Milk", etc.).  Everyone probably remembers the "Heard it through the Grapevine" promotion for California rasins in the 1980s.  While the ads were popular and spawned a cottage industry around the rasin charecters, they did very little to increase rasin sales, which was supposed to be the whole point.

I eat raisins from time to time.  Did so before the CA guys and continued after their ads.  Makes no difference.  Same with milk.

[Red Arrow]

I eat raisins from time to time.  Did so before the CA guys and continued after their ads.  Makes no difference.  Same with milk.

Be sure to keep your rabbits separate from your raisin supply.

[Townsend]

After Uproar, Government Scraps 15-Cent Christmas Tree Fee

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2011/11/10/142211298/after-uproar-government-scraps-15-cent-christmas-tree-fee?ft=1&f=1001&sc=tw&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

It didn't take before the Obama administration backed down on a plan to tax Christmas trees this holiday season. Shortly after the USDA announced it had approved a 15-cent per tree fee, there was an uproar.

Critics jumped on the fee saying it would amount to a new tax because the growers would just pass the price increase along to consumers. Fox News reports that Rep. Steve Scalise, a Republican from Louisiana, dubbed the fee a "Grinch move" by the Obama administration.

Now the story is not that simple, insists the administration, which contends the fee is not a tax. Instead, it was a fee agreed to by the National Christmas Tree Association to launch an image campaign extolling the wonders of natural trees.

Late last night, however, the administration relented. The AP reports:

White House spokesman Matt Lehrich said the USDA would delay the program, but defended it, saying it was not a tax.

"I can tell you unequivocally that the Obama administration is not taxing Christmas trees," Lehrich said. "What's being talked about here is an industry group deciding to impose fees on itself to fund a promotional campaign."

That said, Lehrich added, "USDA is going to delay implementation and revisit this action."

Yesterday, the Christmas tree association issued a statement, saying the fee was "requested by the industry in 2009 and has gone through two industry-wide comment periods." They say that 90 percent of the comments indicated they were in favor of the program, which would have exempted organic farms and small growers.

As ABC News reports, this kind of program is not without precedent. One of the well-known initiatives paid for by a fee of this kind is the "Got Milk" campaign.

The fee was supposed to raise $2 million for the campaign, reports the Chicago Tribune. It was also intended to fight a decline in the sales of natural trees.

"Fresh-tree sales declined from 37 million in 1991 to 31 million in 2007, according to the USDA. Artificial tree sales, meanwhile, nearly doubled, to 17.4 million, from 2003 to 2007," the Tribune reports.

[Teatownclown]

http://www.politifact.com/oregon/statements/2011/nov/09/blog-posting/republicans-bloggers-needle-obama-creating-new-tax/

blow me with that GOP/Teabagger Xmass Tree nonsense.....

Drudge is a jerk.

[Teatownclown]

For David Arnett:

Cratchit Job....

[cannon_fodder]

Christmas isn't even a Christian holiday.  The bible makes no reference to birthday celebrations when Jesus was alive, early Christians never celebrated Christmas, there is no real record of Christmas until more than 400 years after the death of Jesus and wasn't called Christ's Mass until after some thousand years after he died.   Only sinners and pagans celebrated birthdays (read: rich and powerful people who had someone to keep track of such things for them).  Easter is supposed to be the uber holiday of the Christian faith...  but since we don't have Easter parades or giant Easter decorations adorning our government offices no one cares. 

So haul in your sacred trees of life and worship the day the sun begins making longer appearances in the sky, calling it whatever you want.  If your God demands you call a holiday made up centuries after his death and named a millennium after his death by a certain name, then you had better abide.  You don't want to piss off your deity with such trivial details.

[Red Arrow]

Christmas isn't even a Christian holiday.  The bible makes no reference to birthday celebrations when Jesus was alive, early Christians never celebrated Christmas, there is no real record of Christmas until more than 400 years after the death of Jesus and wasn't called Christ's Mass until after some thousand years after he died.   Only sinners and pagans celebrated birthdays (read: rich and powerful people who had someone to keep track of such things for them).  Easter is supposed to be the uber holiday of the Christian faith...  but since we don't have Easter parades or giant Easter decorations adorning our government offices no one cares. 

So haul in your sacred trees of life and worship the day the sun begins making longer appearances in the sky, calling it whatever you want.  If your God demands you call a holiday made up centuries after his death and named a millennium after his death by a certain name, then you had better abide.  You don't want to piss off your deity with such trivial details.

When I was a kid, "spring break" was Easter Vacation and usually included Easter Monday.  Suburban Philadelphia, PA was mostly Christian and Jewish.  The Jewish kids didn't seem to mind the vacation no matter what it was called.  They were allowed to take off for the Jewish holidays without penalty for missing school as I remember it.  I don't know if there was any significant quantity of other major religions.  If there were, they didn't complain too loudly.

Where this is going is Easter Parades.  What about the Easter Bonnet and the Easter Parade from the song.  Seems to have faded away.

[guido911]

Christmas isn't even a Christian holiday.  The bible makes no reference to birthday celebrations when Jesus was alive, early Christians never celebrated Christmas, there is no real record of Christmas until more than 400 years after the death of Jesus and wasn't called Christ's Mass until after some thousand years after he died.   Only sinners and pagans celebrated birthdays (read: rich and powerful people who had someone to keep track of such things for them).  Easter is supposed to be the uber holiday of the Christian faith...  but since we don't have Easter parades or giant Easter decorations adorning our government offices no one cares. 

So haul in your sacred trees of life and worship the day the sun begins making longer appearances in the sky, calling it whatever you want.  If your God demands you call a holiday made up centuries after his death and named a millennium after his death by a certain name, then you had better abide.  You don't want to piss off your deity with such trivial details.

The Catholic Church celebrates numerous holidays/feasts throughout the year that are not spelled out in the Bible--mainly because they are in memory of Saints that may have been martyred centuries after Christ's life and death. And so what if they celebrations didn't begin until 1600-1700 years ago. Does that mean that as a Catholic my recognizing Christ's birthday, which is more than His actual birth, but the immaculate conception, His parents journey to Bethlehem, and so forth. The Church also celebrates Advent, which is a significant part of my personal faith. Please, continue mocking it though.

[custosnox]

The Catholic Church celebrates numerous holidays/feasts throughout the year that are not spelled out in the Bible--mainly because they are in memory of Saints that may have been martyred centuries after Christ's life and death. And so what if they celebrations didn't begin until 1600-1700 years ago. Does that mean that as a Catholic my recognizing Christ's birthday, which is more than His actual birth, but the immaculate conception, His parents journey to Bethlehem, and so forth. The Church also celebrates Advent, which is a significant part of my personal faith. Please, continue mocking it though.

Many of the main stream "Christian" holidays were arranged to be celebrated on Pagan days of worship.  The word Easter, in fact, comes from the goddess of fertility and rebirth.  If I recall correctly her name was Etre.  Sol Invictus and Apollo both were considered born on the winter soltice.  The Holy day, or All Saint's day, was moved to November 1st to overshadow the fall festivals, which didn't do so well since so many Christians condemn Halloween.  The point being made is that Christians are making a fuss over the naming of a day that they procured from other cultures and beliefs.

[guido911]

Many of the main stream "Christian" holidays were arranged to be celebrated on Pagan days of worship.  The word Easter, in fact, comes from the goddess of fertility and rebirth.  If I recall correctly her name was Etre.  Sol Invictus and Apollo both were considered born on the winter soltice.  The Holy day, or All Saint's day, was moved to November 1st to overshadow the fall festivals, which didn't do so well since so many Christians condemn Halloween.  The point being made is that Christians are making a fuss over the naming of a day that they procured from other cultures and beliefs.

And again, does it matter? I don't care what the source is/was for these holidays or why they are on the dates they are. Right now, in 2011, Christmas is celebrated on December 25. It has been my entire life. When I celebrate Christmas, I am not celebrating anything remotely pagan. To me, folks that even make that the argument for taking Christianity out of Christmas are desperate. Don't like Christmas or what it stands for, don't celebrate it. Just don't run me down because I choose to, or if I want some of the trappings associated with Christmas like parades, tree lightings, etc. which has been a large part of my family tradition.

[Red Arrow]

And again, does it matter? 

If you are firm in your beliefs, it doesn't matter what others think.  I do think you are being a bit overly defensive when others make statements of their beliefs that do not coincide with yours.  Although some may be mocking your beliefs, most others just don't agree.

I think many religious ceremonies are man made.  If they develop to symbolize something to the believers, that's fine. I believe that the early Christians adopted many pagan holidays and gave them Christian meaning to attract new members.  That's OK by me.  If you cannot accept that, that's OK too.

[guido911]

If you are firm in your beliefs, it doesn't matter what others think.  I do think you are being a bit overly defensive when others make statements of their beliefs that do not coincide with yours.  Although some may be mocking your beliefs, most others just don't agree.

I think many religious ceremonies are man made.  If they develop to symbolize something to the believers, that's fine. I believe that the early Christians adopted many pagan holidays and gave them Christian meaning to attract new members.  That's OK by me.  If you cannot accept that, that's OK too.

Christmas is not a Christian holiday is a belief structure?