He sort of looks clairvoyant now. doesn't he?

[Conan71]

As for raising wages, well we have proven beyond any doubt whatsoever that sending all the manufacturing to China to get "cheaper labor" did NOTHING to reduce prices here.  

Actually, in real money terms it has when you can buy the same product which used to be made in America and sold 20 years ago for $100 and that product, now made in China or Mexico can still be bought for $100.

[Gaspar]

Actually, in real money terms it has when you can buy the same product which used to be made in America and sold 20 years ago for $100 and that product, now made in China or Mexico can still be bought for $100.

I try to buy American, however it's becoming increasingly difficult to source quality american finger traps.

[Red Arrow]

Grad school.  This was late 70's, early 80's so he either may have gone or retired by now.

All my classes were on north campus.

As for raising wages, well we have proven beyond any doubt whatsoever that sending all the manufacturing to China to get "cheaper labor" did NOTHING to reduce prices here.  

I'll use Obama's defense for the stimulus, it could have been worse.  Actually, I agree that outsourcing to China has not necessarily worked for most of us.  ESPECIALLY exporting skilled jobs that Americans do want to do.

You raise salaries because of other increases due to inflation AND increases in productivity.  The goal is to keep people employed and financially improving so that they can continue to buy the stuff the business makes.  Peter Drucker explains it well...try a diet of Drucker instead of Fox for a while.  

You need to stop listening MSNBC.  I'm not about to turn down a raise in pay to compensate for inflation but it does nothing to stop inflation.  I remember Nate saying that inflation is a good thing.  Remember that when you start living on a mostly fixed income.  It will keep your spirits up while you cannot afford a hamburger.

If what you say is true, then what is the rationale for raising all the CEO pay?  By the orders of magnitude they have increased it in recent history!

CEO pay has increased beyond any increase in productivity in my mind.  It's kind of like a Union for the 1%ers.
 

[nathanm]

I'm not about to turn down a raise in pay to compensate for inflation but it does nothing to stop inflation.

No, but it does make it easier to service any debt you may have, which is an excellent thing when the whole economy is being weighed down by debt.

[Red Arrow]

No, but it does make it easier to service any debt you may have, which is an excellent thing when the whole economy is being weighed down by debt.

Circular argument.  A raise makes it easier to pay for things that increased in price because most of us got a raise to pay for things that increased in price.  I am one of a dozen or so Americans with no credit card debt so inflation does not really help me.  For the most part pay raises don't really keep pace with inflation.  Maybe I have just worked for the wrong companies.  Inflation is eating up any gains my 401K and other savings are eeking out.

[heironymouspasparagus]

Circular argument.  A raise makes it easier to pay for things that increased in price because most of us got a raise to pay for things that increased in price.  I am one of a dozen or so Americans with no credit card debt so inflation does not really help me.  For the most part pay raises don't really keep pace with inflation.  Maybe I have just worked for the wrong companies.  Inflation is eating up any gains my 401K and other savings are eeking out.

You just stated exactly what we have been saying for a long, long, time.

Your pay has been going down in real terms for decades.  401k plans as a replacement for a defined benefit retirement have been and always will be an unmitigated, losing catastrophe for the retired in this country - even the Wall Street Journal shows reservations.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123137714796462913.html

Which means it has long ago crashed and burned.

[Red Arrow]

Your pay has been going down in real terms for decades. 

And you expect to fix that with more inflation?

[heironymouspasparagus]

And you expect to fix that with more inflation?

No.  You know better.  It is the thing that has been talked about to death here...quit taking from the poor and giving to the rich.

[Red Arrow]

No.  You know better.  It is the thing that has been talked about to death here...quit taking from the poor and giving to the rich.

Any you know better than to keep spouting off about your reverse Robin Hood thing.  You are almost as obsessed with that as you are with Fox and Murdoch.

[heironymouspasparagus]

Any you know better than to keep spouting off about your reverse Robin Hood thing.  You are almost as obsessed with that as you are with Fox and Murdoch.

I guess so...reality is big for me.

[nathanm]

And you expect to fix that with more inflation?

If we fix whatever is causing workers to not share in the productivity gains, then yes.

[heironymouspasparagus]

If we fix whatever is causing workers to not share in the productivity gains, then yes.

Exactly.  Well said.

[Conan71]

If we fix whatever is causing workers to not share in the productivity gains, then yes.

New envy talking point?  I kind of like that one, rolls off the tongue well.

And what would that fix be?  A "medium wage" law?

[nathanm]

And what would that fix be?  A "medium wage" law?

No, probably fixing our broken corporate governance.

[Red Arrow]

I guess so...reality is big for me.

I hope some day you find it (reality).