TULSA'S WATER GOES DOWN THE DRAIN!

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Can't remember the call sign, but when I was a kid, had a crystal radio kit (probably still have it somewhere...) that I had put together that got a Chicago station most nights.  Don't remember liking what they played, but it was so fascinating listening to radio so far away, I just had to be there...

Probably WLS in Chicago.  We could get it in S.E. PA too.  Dad had an extra surplus military WWII multiband receiver that my brother and I had in our room. (Actually, I probably still have it somewhere in the attic or the outbuilding.)  We heard a lot of broadcast stations from the midwest.

[heironymouspasparagus]

Probably WLS in Chicago.  We could get it in S.E. PA too.  Dad had an extra surplus military WWII multiband receiver that my brother and I had in our room. (Actually, I probably still have it somewhere in the attic or the outbuilding.)  We heard a lot of broadcast stations from the midwest.

YES!  That was it!  Thanks!

[shadows]

Amateur (Ham) Radio Operators? Sun activity affects the skip but lower frequencies can bend over the line of sight anyway.  My dad was a Ham and regularly talked all over the world.

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CB-10W3815. 

Ham-W5PYV 

Been there also. 

[Teatownclown]

http://signon.org/sign/stop-the-use-of-chloramine?source=s.em.mt&r_by=5046976

STOP the use of chloramine in The Tulsa Area Water!
By Victoria Clark (Contact)

To be delivered to: Mayor Dewey Bartlett, The TMUA, and Tulsa City Council

We, the undersigned, are asking you for a moratorium on the use of chloramine in drinking water in Tulsa until more studies are done regarding the acute and long term effects of chloramine and it's byproducts as well as the impact on our homes, aquatic life and watersheds.

The safety assurances you have given Tulsans are solely based on the regulated byproducts of chloramine. The unregulated byproducts have only recently have begun to been studied! Even the EPA website itself reveals that these studies are showing that the unregulated byproducts of chloraminated water are "highly genotoxic" and "cause adverse health effects".

•   You say chloramine has been safely used for 90 years, yet safety on humans wasn't studied until recently. The current growing body of scientific research is indicating that the use of chloramines is mutagenic, cytotoxic and carcinogenic.

•   Chloramine is known to leach lead into the water supply. Multiple children in Washington D.C. and North Carolina are known to have suffered lead poisoning from chloraminated water.

•   Chloramine eats rubber fittings in plumbing and is known to damage seals and parts within the water distribution system, including within homes.

•   Chloramine is toxic to fish and amphibians in our ecosystem, down to the earthworm.

It appears that we are fast approaching the time when science will conclude that choramine is unsafe for humans just as they realized, too late, that lead paint asbestos and thalidomide were unsafe. Don't expose Tulsans to these risks when you have the alternative, safe, and affordable option of carbon filtering to meet the EPA 2012 guidelines for Tulsa. We know that you have 3-4 years time before the compliance date-take that time to consider what scientists are discovering: the cytotoxic, genotoxic, carcinogenic, and other adverse health effects of chloramines.

We ask you to consider what the science is showing about the unregulated byproducts of chloramine and take the responsible action to protect the citizens under your watch. Please STOP the use of chloramine in Tulsa now.

[AquaMan]

What are the byproducts of Chloramine and how are they produced?

[nathanm]

Sometimes we have to kill ourselves slowly to avoid killing ourselves quickly. Such is life.

[Teatownclown]

Today's Gall Street Journal has an article about two young men in NYC selling purified water. Molecule...they know.

What Are They Drinking in New York City?
New Shop Sells Tap Water Run Through Filtering System; Officials Proud of H20

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444330904577535100599492544.html

By SOPHIA HOLLANDER

New York is known for its food niche stores: The Hummus Place. The Doughnut Plant. The Dumpling Man. Even a spot dedicated solely to rice pudding.

But this week, a store in the East Village went a step further: It sells New York City tap water.

Not just any tap water, insist the owners of Molecule. They say the water streams through a $25,000 filtering machine that uses ultraviolet rays, ozone treatments and reverse osmosis in a seven-stage processing treatment to create what they call pure H20.

Despite the start-up costs, it is the ideal business model, they say, since they never have to worry about spoiled products or storage costs. And then there is the taste: "I mean it's subtle, but if you have a sensitive palate you can totally tell" the difference, said co-owner Adam Ruhf.

Water quality has long been a point of pride for New Yorkers, touted by Mayor Michael Bloomberg as one of the city's signature distinctions.

The owners of Molecule—Alexander Venet, a local art dealer and restaurant owner, and Mr. Ruhf, a former world champion boomerang player, musician and self-described social-justice activist—vehemently disagree.

"Terrible," said Mr. Ruhf, who moved to New York from California about a year ago. "I don't want chemicals in my water. I don't even want chlorine in my water. Chlorine is like bleach. Do you want to drink bleach? No one wants to drink bleach. So that's my opinion on New York tap water."

"Public health experts agree that New York City tap water is among the safest, highest quality in the world, a standard we confirm through more than 500,000 tests each year," said Christopher Gilbride, a spokesman for the New York City Department of Environmental Protection.

Some scientists and environmentalists suggest there is a need for some water treatment: A 2006 report by the National Academy of Sciences found that federal regulations allowed potentially dangerous amounts of fluoride into drinking water. The Environmental Protection Agency has since lowered its recommended levels. John Doull, a professor emeritus of toxicology at the University of Kansas Medical Center who chaired the NAS report, says lower levels may also pose concern, but "we don't have enough evidence to satisfy a regulatory requirement."

Nneka Leiba, a senior research analyst with the Washington, D.C.-based Environmental Working Group, said the nonprofit organization recommends filtering all drinking water.

But she questioned whether New Yorkers should pay a premium for filtered water—in this case, $2.50 plus tax for a 16-ounce glass bottle (only $1 for up to 50 ounces if you bring your own container).

"Their water quality is not that bad to begin with," she said, adding that a $15 in-home filtration system would probably suffice.

When it comes to water, the answers are murky. The East Village store wades into a controversy that has brewed among water aficionados for decades. Some deride the stripped-down H20 as "dead water" because its natural minerals have been eliminated along with the chemicals.

To counteract critics, Molecule is planning a weekly naming ceremony to imbue its water with personality and Sunday blessings involving religious figures from all faiths, including Tibetan monks and pagan worshipers.

"Either you buy into it or you don't," said Mr. Ruhf, who came up with the idea for Molecule after sampling a similar store in California.

The tiny shop looks more like a laboratory than a love-in. Brightly lighted and spare, Molecule is dominated by the giant filtration machine, a vast tank connected to tubes, pipes and monitoring dials. Along the back wall hangs a line of long, thin burettes filled with colored liquids. Sales are rung up on an iPad.

Mr. Ruhf has combined the store with his second dream: creating an "all natural sports-drink line, like Gatorade for yogis." Or in language perhaps more familiar to New Yorkers, a cocktail bar for water enthusiasts. Patrons can order a shot of vitamins A, B, C, D and E or a mixture of roots, herbs, fruits and mushrooms blended in blasts called "energy," "immunity" and "skin, hair and nails" to add to their water.

Coming soon, he said: mixtures for anti-inflammatory, detox, digestion, vision and virility.

"Nothing tastes bad," he said. Though not everyone raves, "I haven't had anyone express revulsion yet."

To "sex it up a little bit," the store is also offering electrolyte and pH infusions, Mr. Ruhf said. For those longing for a heartier snack, it sells organic energy bars.


Mr. Ruhf says his water is unusually "fluffy" with a "smooth" finish. (A reporter found it lighter and more velvety than city tap water.) Still, some are skeptical.

"There's not as much of a quality difference between different waters," said Brandon Lederhouse, who was visiting a friend in the neighborhood. "It's not like people are going to be saying, 'Oh, this water tastes so much better than the Poland Spring I got on the corner.' "

His friend disagreed. "I think you'll have people who will start becoming water connoisseurs," said his friend, Caitlin Garcia.

That is just what Messrs. Ruhf and Venet are hoping.

On Tuesday afternoon they were awaiting the delivery of an adult tricycle they plan to use to deliver BPA-free plastic jugs—and water refills—to homes and businesses.

Still, they may have convincing to do: Even some of their single-item brethren were taken aback. "Water?" said Aaron Gallentine, who works two blocks away at the Dumpling Man, when informed of the idea. "I'm a little bit in shock."

"I have one to thing to say: Good luck to them," he continued, though he slowly warmed to the idea. "It's so completely random, and the East Village is so completely random. I think this may be the only place this could possibly work."

—Tania Karas contributed to this article.
A version of this article appeared July 19, 2012, on page A1 in the U.S. edition of The Wall Street Journal, with the headline: What Are They Drinking In New York City?

[shadows]

What are the byproducts of Chloramine and how are they produced?

Since Chloramines are used to produce hydrazine as a explosive element to produce rocket fuel, the adding it in the drinking water could put a little zip in the termination of the human race as we know it. Our immune system requires certain good germs in the water to retain our digestive tracks which are essential to maintain our bodies of which sustain what we call life.  We will genocide this species called man.  Science says we involved from the dinosaurs after they ate themselves out of food, and after 60 million years man appeared.  There is a question if this mass explosion of technology we are experiencing during our region will bring about our demise.

[Hoss]

Since Chloramines are used to produce hydrazine as a explosive element to produce rocket fuel, the adding it in the drinking water could put a little zip in the termination of the human race as we know it. Our immune system requires certain good germs in the water to retain our digestive tracks which are essential to maintain our bodies of which sustain what we call life.  We will genocide this species called man.  Science says we involved from the dinosaurs after they ate themselves out of food, and after 60 million years man appeared.  There is a question if this mass explosion of technology we are experiencing during our region will bring about our demise.

[shadows]

Good post.  Is that the citizens of Pompeii in 79 that they are uncovering now?  As you are aware the citizens didn't believe the rumbling mountain and warnings meant anything until the ashes covered them.   

[Hoss]

Good post.  Is that the citizens of Pompeii in 79 that they are uncovering now?  As you are aware the citizens didn't believe the rumbling mountain and warnings meant anything until the ashes covered them.   

Where's the quadruple facepalm at?

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Since Chloramines are used to produce hydrazine as a explosive element to produce rocket fuel, the adding it in the drinking water could put a little zip in the termination of the human race as we know it. Our immune system requires certain good germs in the water to retain our digestive tracks which are essential to maintain our bodies of which sustain what we call life. 

Eat some more Activia yogurt.

[Red Arrow]

I recently saw a presentation on a water pH modifying system.  "They" claimed that high pH water was the elixir of liquids.  At least I think they said alkaline water was better.  I might have it backwards.  They also offered a filter system that could remove Chloramines.  I didn't stay for the whole live infomercial.

[Conan71]

I recently saw a presentation on a water pH modifying system.  "They" claimed that high pH water was the elixir of liquids.  At least I think they said alkaline water was better.  I might have it backwards.  They also offered a filter system that could remove Chloramines.  I didn't stay for the whole live infomercial.

Depends on what you need the water for as to what the ideal pH is.  For most household purposes, a pH around 8 or so is pretty ideal.  Tulsa water is not far off what is considered "mineral water" by the snake oil salesmen.  Moderate alkalinity, moderate hardness, not particularly high in iron or sulfides.  Still not sure where the Will Rogers Hotel in Claremore got their "miracle" water from.  If it was off the Verdigris watershed, it's the same water much of Tulsa bathes in daily.

[nathanm]

Where's the quadruple facepalm at?

Perhaps this will suffice: