Carry a gun? Pass a drug test.

[heironymouspasparagus]

But please remember this... a guns intended use is to cause injury, specifically death, in another living being.  Whether that being be on four legs or two. 

I have been know to shoot spiders.  Don't they count, with their 8 legs??

[Conan71]

But what level of mental illness?  OCD is mental illness... Gambling addiction?  Narcolepsy?  Dyslexia?  You cannot broadbrush.

As for control itself, I have seen a lot of references to the statement that guns don't kill people, people kill people.  To a certain degree, this is correct.  But please remember this... a guns intended use is to cause injury, specifically death, in another living being.  Whether that being be on four legs or two.  Assult weapons have been created specifically to kill other people.  So by nature, a gun operated as intended will kill the person or thing it is aimed at.  A sledgehammer's intended use is the demolition of a structure, a cars intended use is transportation from one location to another.  The problem with these is when it is not being used as intended.  The same cannot be said about a gun.  I am for responsible gun ownership but I also understand that laws only keep honest people honest.

Killing is not the sole purpose of a firearm.  There are sporting clays and target shooting competitions they are used in as well, it's even an Olympic sport.  I never use a firearm to kill anything other than old cans, paper targets, clay pigeons, metal drop targets, and dead trees.  I know others who also don't hunt anything but enjoy target practice and shooting competitions.

A gun is like a sledgehammer, car, or butcher knife.  In the hands of the wrong person any of them can be quite deadly.

There simply is a focus on guns because of recent mass shootings.  Mass shootings are an exceedingly small portion of preventable deaths in our country every year.  Alcohol interlocks in every vehicle on the road would do far more to cut innocent or accidental deaths in our country than gun restrictions.  So would a ban on all tobacco products.

It seems to me the issue is more about controlling firearms rather than saving lives.

[Gaspar]

It seems to me the issue is more about controlling firearms rather than saving lives.

FIFY

[JCnOwasso]

Killing is not the sole purpose of a firearm.  There are sporting clays and target shooting competitions they are used in as well, it's even an Olympic sport.  I never use a firearm to kill anything other than old cans, paper targets, clay pigeons, metal drop targets, and dead trees.  I know others who also don't hunt anything but enjoy target practice and shooting competitions.

A gun is like a sledgehammer, car, or butcher knife.  In the hands of the wrong person any of them can be quite deadly.

I have reviewed my post and found that at no time did I say that a guns sole purpose was to kill people.  I did say that it is the intended use of a gun, except for those which are manufactured for the use in shooting competitions etc. Assult weapons, were developed to kill people.  I am not grabbing an AR-15 (M16) to have a little target practice.  I am grabbing that to prepare for war or zombie apocalypse.  And a gun in ANYONES hands is quite deadly...  If I see a menacing person walking down the street with a gun, I am frightened.  If I see a menacing person with a sledgehammer, car or butcher knife, I am less frightened, because I know that I can generally out run a person with a heavy sledge, I can out maneuver a person with car, and I can also get away from a person with a knife.  A gun you cannot out maneuver, outrun, or get away from a bullet.   

[nathanm]

It seems to me the issue is more about controlling firearms rather than saving lives.

If it were about saving lives, we'd have banned (or at least extremely restricted) handguns 40 years ago. Note how rarely firearms subject to the NFA are used illegally. Maybe a couple of times a year at most. Handguns, on the other hand, are routinely purchased by straw buyers for sale to the black market. Maybe there are indeed other ways to approach the problem, but handguns are the instrument of choice in most gun deaths despite being only a third of all guns in circulation in the US, so arguing that restrictions on handguns are necessarily about people being uncomfortable with guns or whatever isn't reasonable.

But yes, we are talking about it right now because of mass shootings in recent months. Sad that over 8,000 people murdered and another 22,000 people either suiciding or being accidentally killed by firearms each year doesn't rate discussion all on its own.

And comparing it to driving is silly. Firstly, the difference between firearm-related deaths and auto-related deaths is very small these days. Secondly, auto-related fatalities are lower (relative to population) than they have been at any time since 1918 while gun deaths continue to rise relative to population.

Edited to add: I should have noted that gun deaths are far lower than they were between about 1985-1995, but have been on the rise for the past decade or so. And less than 40% of auto fatalities are caused by drunk drivers. 40% is the official number, but counts all "alcohol-related" crashes, which includes crashes in which a driver, passenger, or bystander has even 0.01% BAC, even if the involved driver(s) has/have no detectable alcohol or are under the legal limit.

[Conan71]

If it were about saving lives, we'd have banned (or at least extremely restricted) handguns 40 years ago. Note how rarely firearms subject to the NFA are used illegally. Maybe a couple of times a year at most. Handguns, on the other hand, are routinely purchased by straw buyers for sale to the black market. Maybe there are indeed other ways to approach the problem, but handguns are the instrument of choice in most gun deaths despite being only a third of all guns in circulation in the US, so arguing that restrictions on handguns are necessarily about people being uncomfortable with guns or whatever isn't reasonable.

But yes, we are talking about it right now because of mass shootings in recent months. Sad that over 8,000 people murdered and another 22,000 people either suiciding or being accidentally killed by firearms each year doesn't rate discussion all on its own.

And comparing it to driving is silly. Firstly, the difference between firearm-related deaths and auto-related deaths is very small these days. Secondly, auto-related fatalities are lower (relative to population) than they have been at any time since 1918 while gun deaths continue to rise relative to population.

Edited to add: I should have noted that gun deaths are far lower than they were between about 1985-1995, but have been on the rise for the past decade or so. And less than 40% of auto fatalities are caused by drunk drivers. 40% is the official number, but counts all "alcohol-related" crashes, which includes crashes in which a driver, passenger, or bystander has even 0.01% BAC, even if the involved driver(s) has/have no detectable alcohol or are under the legal limit.

Nate, it doesn't matter how it happens. Dead IS dead.

[heironymouspasparagus]

If it were about saving lives, we'd have banned (or at least extremely restricted)....

That's the whole point.  It's not about saving lives.  If it were, there are a vast number of things that we would have done in many other areas first.

[Gaspar]

The US Shooting Academy in Tulsa is offering CC classes to teachers for free.  So far 300 have signed up.  That's a pretty good number.

Nutjobs beware, next time may not be so easy, at least not in Tulsa.

[guido911]

Something else to make some in here regret living here.

http://blog.tenthamendmentcenter.com/2013/01/2nd-amendment-preservation-act-introduced-in-oklahoma/

[Townsend]

Something else to make some in here regret living here.

http://blog.tenthamendmentcenter.com/2013/01/2nd-amendment-preservation-act-introduced-in-oklahoma/

That'll work out.

[Teatownclown]

Something else to make some in here regret living here.

http://blog.tenthamendmentcenter.com/2013/01/2nd-amendment-preservation-act-introduced-in-oklahoma/

related news!

http://www.mediaite.com/online/white-nationalist-party-among-sponsors-of-gun-appreciation-day/

[heironymouspasparagus]

related news!

What you and others seem to have lost track of is the fact that the Constitution does not "give" us rights - it enumerates unalienable rights that we are endowed with by our Creator.  By definition of the documents defining our very existence!  (Except, of course, when expedient to let big business have a boon, as in big oil, banks or insurance companies, since after all, they are more special than actual people, being able to afford to buy Congress and all that...)

The government, again by definition, is specifically created to secure these rights.  And then when that government becomes destructive to that end, it is the Right, again by definition, of the People, to alter or abolish it and institute new government most likely to fulfill these ends.  I paraphrase...

[AquaMan]

Sounds pretty revolutionary. The subtext of a lot of 2a fanaticals (not indicting you H) is this concept of being able to defend against the tyranny of their own government. Unlike the tyranny foisted by an unelected King upon the colonies, this alleged tyranny would be from a government "of and by the people".

Should that happen it would indeed be the abolishment of the current government along with several million of its inhabitants. Then the defense of a shattered government and economy against its enemies would ensue. Good luck with aiming that Bushmaster at drones, helicopters and tanks.

[guido911]

What you and others seem to have lost track of is the fact that the Constitution does not "give" us rights - it enumerates unalienable rights that we are endowed with by our Creator.  By definition of the documents defining our very existence!  (Except, of course, when expedient to let big business have a boon, as in big oil, banks or insurance companies, since after all, they are more special than actual people, being able to afford to buy Congress and all that...)

The government, again by definition, is specifically created to secure these rights.  And then when that government becomes destructive to that end, it is the Right, again by definition, of the People, to alter or abolish it and institute new government most likely to fulfill these ends.  I paraphrase...

You have a declaration of independence and constitution mash up going on there.

[patric]

The US Shooting Academy in Tulsa is offering CC classes to teachers for free.  So far 300 have signed up.  That's a pretty good number.

And Im sure this would have turned out so much better with the introduction of another gun:

A Tulsa, Oklahoma elementary school principal is fighting to have her case dismissed following a March incident in which she was arrested after asking if police searching her daughter's residence had a warrant to do so.

The case of Lynnette Dixon is about a black woman speaking up in a city where one race usually rules, civil rights leaders and Dixon's lawyer say.
That point was made clear in an email made public last week in which the Tulsa schools chief of police told Tulsa police officers the system wanted to fire Dixon, and her arrest would help their case.

The incident began on March 7, when police went to the residence of Dixon's daughter who lives in subsidized housing. A neighbor had accused the daughter and her boyfriend of burglary, according to her attorney, Richard O'Carroll.

Police were going through the apartment when Dixon arrived. She asked her daughter if the officers searching her home had a warrant. She also told her daughter to get the officers' badge numbers, according to O'Carroll.

"Ms. Dixon asked them what they were doing. Instead of asking her to be quiet, they told her to leave," O'Carroll told BlackAmericaWeb.com.
Dixon was charged with obstructing a police officer and fined $200, according to O'Carroll. She was placed on paid leave from the Tulsa Public School System, but the incident could cost Dixon her job as principal of Hawthorne Elementary School, the lawyer said.

"Ms. Dixon is a good principal. The parents are supporting her. The school is not at risk," he said. "She meets all of the challenges and deals with them, helping the children to succeed."
Hawthorne has 430 students, and 99.7 percent of the students are on either free or reduced lunch. An overwhelmingly majority of the students – 94 percent – are African-American, according to the school's web site.

"This is not only affecting Ms. Dixon. It's affecting the students and their families," Blakney said.
School officials told BlackAmericaWeb.com they could not comment on Ms. Dixon, or the email from Tulsa Public Schools Police Chief Gary Rudick, obtained by NewsChannel 8.

Here is an excerpt of the email to Tulsa police made public in Oklahoma and dated March 8:

    "I am sure you know the fat is in the fire over the arrest of Principal Lynette Dixon. The NAACP is having a support mtg for a public show of support tonight. We served a suspension letter on Dixon this afternoon and about 40 people were at her home all bitching about the racists cops we all are.

    "We want to fire this woman so your case is important to us. I've got Collburn on this from our end gathering admin data. He spoke to your guys. We intend to interview the security guards. Here is what I think is the best course.

    "We don't want any reports or statements on paper that are not already a matter of public record. I suspect that when we fire her that her attorney will want a hearing and try to do discovery at the hearing on anything we use. For that reason, we are simply putting a report together that is based on our interviews and what is already public, nothing more. That way if we go to an admin hearing BEFORE the court proceeding, we don't have a lot for them to do discovery on. However, chances are good that the attorney would subpoena your guys to our admin hearing in order to do exactly that........ discovery of what the case would be about."

    "If the criminal case is dismissed it will hurt us badly in trying to fire this woman. I think someone from TPD needs to make sure the Prosecutors are on board this case and don't dismiss it out of hand or bow to public pressure. There will be a great deal of pressure on this as we've been getting calls here and to the Sup's office all day.

    "I am so glad that your guys arrested her ..."
http://www.thesavvysista.com/2011/04/curious-case-of-lynette-dixon-and-tulsa.html