Raise the Minimum Wage

[carltonplace]

At $9.00 PER HOUR gross income is $18,720 for full time employee or $1,560 per month.

TULSA MSA RATES
1 BEDROOM $587
2 BEDROOM $779
Source: http://www.apartmentratings.com/rate?a=MSAAvgRentalPrice&msa=8560#axzz2KtopX0hC

Public Transit
10 RIDE PASS (1 WEEK) $12.00
Source: http://tulsatransit.org/fares-passes/cash-fare/

Day Care
$140 per week
Source: http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=694&articleid=20120824_11_A1_CUTLIN918706

Single Mother with one child, no car
$1,560
- $779 RENT
- $48   TRANSPORTATION (TO/FROM WORK ONLY)
- $120 UTILITIES
-$300 GROCERIES
- $560 DAY CARE
OT required, no money left for self education, clothes, insurance or anything other than subsisting.

[DolfanBob]

So would you call this situation. Americas middle class?

[Gaspar]

At $9.00 PER HOUR gross income is $18,720 for full time employee or $1,560 per month.

TULSA MSA RATES
1 BEDROOM $587
2 BEDROOM $779
Source: http://www.apartmentratings.com/rate?a=MSAAvgRentalPrice&msa=8560#axzz2KtopX0hC

Public Transit
10 RIDE PASS (1 WEEK) $12.00
Source: http://tulsatransit.org/fares-passes/cash-fare/

Day Care
$140 per week
Source: http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=694&articleid=20120824_11_A1_CUTLIN918706

Single Mother with one child, no car
$1,560
- $779 RENT
- $48   TRANSPORTATION (TO/FROM WORK ONLY)
- $120 UTILITIES
-$300 GROCERIES
- $560 DAY CARE
OT required, no money left for self education, clothes, insurance or anything other than subsisting.

That is true.  Minimum wage is not meant to be a "permanent wage" for anyone.  It is the starting point to encourage income mobility and growth.

If the employeer has several such "single mothers with one child, and no car," and the state mandates that he pay them more than he currently can afford in either wages or benefits, his only choices are to reduce his workforce or increase his prices (if the market will bare it).

If he reduces his workforce, many "single mothers" that accept minimum wage as a "permanent wage" will likely have no job.  If businesses choose to increase prices to make up for the increase in labor expense, then your "single mother" will make more money, but she will also pay significantly more money for the RENT, TRANSPORTATION, UTILITIES, GROCERIES, and DAYCARE.

Of course what typically happens is a blend of both economic reactions.  A reduction in overall workforce, and an increase in consumer prices. Eventually, of course it all evens out for workers moving through the workforce, but for those at the entry level, such as the young, or the very unskilled are typically the ones to suffer the most as this acts as a barrier for employment.

Now if you really look at what your "single mother" making $18,720 gets, you have a different story.


Lets just round up to $19,000.
She gets a tax refund exceeding what she pays, bringing her income up to about $23,000.
With SNAP she gets much of her food assistance bringing her income up to bout $29,000.
She gets housing assistance taking her past $35,000.
She also gets childcare and access to other assistance putting her between $50,000 and $55,000.

Now, here's the strange part, if you were to bring minimum wage up to $14.45 an hour, your "single mother" would lose $5,000 a year.
If she were to earn $21.65 an hour, her income would drop by over $10,000.

[Red Arrow]

That is true.  Minimum wage is not meant to be a "permanent wage" for anyone.  It is the starting point to encourage income mobility and growth.

Now, here's the strange part, if you were to bring minimum wage up to $14.45 an hour, your "single mother" would lose $5,000 a year.
If she were to earn $21.65 an hour, her income would drop by over $10,000.

All that means is that we need to take more money from the top 1% to give to working, single, uneducated mothers. 

[Townsend]

I just saw these last posts on a show about Walmart.

[Gaspar]

All that means is that we need to take more money from the top 1% to give to working, single, uneducated mothers. 

We could do that, or we could focus on educating young people to make better life choices.

Poverty is more of a state of mind, than a state of being.

[Townsend]

We could do that, or we could focus on educating young people to make better life choices.

Like "just say no to drugs" and "abstinence is the most effective birth control."  "Kids, make better choices."

What do you think would be even more effective?

[Red Arrow]

We could do that, or we could focus on educating young people to make better life choices.

No motivation for education.  We might as well get used to the idea that everyone is entitled to a lifestyle to which they would like to become accustomed.

[Gaspar]

Like "just say no to drugs" and "abstinence is the most effective birth control."  "Kids, make better choices."

What do you think would be even more effective?

I don't know of anything more successful in promoting opportunity than education, positive roll models, and awareness of the rewards & consequences of individual choice.

I suppose their may be other options, I am simply unaware of them.

What would you suggest?

[Townsend]

I don't know of anything more successful in promoting opportunity than education, positive roll models, and awareness of the rewards & consequences of individual choice.

Those sound great.  Let's see if we have any political leaders with stroke actively promoting them.

Let's see...

Looking some more...

I'm coming up empty.

[Gaspar]

Those sound great.  Let's see if we have any political leaders with stroke actively promoting them.

Let's see...

Looking some more...

I'm coming up empty.

Good politicians are hard to spot.  Here's a hint:  Look for the person who promises the least.

We seem to favor various types of government guaranteed and compulsory security. We say that we want personal freedom, but we demand government housing, government price controls, government-guaranteed jobs and wages. We want to be responsible persons, but we vote for candidates who promise us the most.  As long as we do that our problems will continue to multiply, because they are being subsidized, and we are becoming too weak to acknowledge, and too stupid to understand the loss of freedom that represents.

When you subsidize poverty and failure, you get more of both. – James Dale Davidson

The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience. – Albert Camus

We have a system that increasingly taxes work and subsidizes non-work. – Milton Friedman

The welfare state is the oldest con game in the world. First you take people's money away quietly, and then you give some of it back to them flamboyantly. – Thomas Sowell

Past studies by and large confirm the prediction that higher minimum wages reduce employment opportunities and raise unemployment, particularly among teenagers, minorities and other low-skilled workers. – Masanori Hashimoto

[Red Arrow]

Those sound great.  Let's see if we have any political leaders with stroke actively promoting them.
Let's see...
Looking some more...
I'm coming up empty.

http://www.triadeye.com/new-patient-form/

[Townsend]

Good politicians are hard to spot.  Here's a hint:  Look for the person who promises the least.

The loser?

[Gaspar]

The loser?

Unfortunately today that is probably the case. 

[carltonplace]

Gaspar - RE: "permanent wage"
If these companies cared about their workers then we wouldn't need to enforce a minimum wage. The companies would pay per performance and would reward hard work with advancement. These things no longer exist.

I'm fairly sure that you understand that minimum wage jobs also rarely have any benefits package.

How does a single mother working 60+ hours a week to make ends meet find a way to care for her child and pay for an education?
Do we consider that she and her child are victims of their circumstances and not worthy or capable of more?

RED ARROW - Requesting fair compensation is not reallocation of wealth. These people are working for the money they are paid, they should be paid fairly for it.