Ukraine

[Gaspar]

Calm down, we have tested the Trident II successfully 143 times and as recently last October. It just doesn't make the news. Quit being so dramatic.

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/us/news/press-releases/2012/october/1031-ss-trident.html

Now the Trident II D5 is a truly scary weapon. Each missile has 5-8 independently targetable half megaton warheads. 24 Trident II D5 missiles are on each one of our 14 nuclear armed Ohio class subs. The subs don't even have to surface to fire. You know we have one or two of those in the Black Sea right now. Putin knows that too, though he doesn't know exactly where. Putin wants to rebuild the Russian (Soviet) empire, not burn it down.

The paper tiger has nuclear teeth.

No matter what his intensions are, you can be assured they will not play to our advantage.  I just pray that our president is willing to deliver more than lip-service.  Putin has Crimea and is not going to pull back.  Best we can hope for is to somehow keep him from using this victory as an excuse to take other former soviet properties under the premise that they are Russia's to take.

Putin is nothing but ego and action.  On the contrary, Kerry's comment on Sunday pretty much sums up the amazing diplomacy skills he brings to the table. "Invasion is not the act of someone who is strong. It is the act of someone who is weak."  I'm sure this really made Putin think about his life, and how he may have hurt people.

[Conan71]

It was a planned test firing. It was not a surprise test.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/russia-test-fires-icbm-amid-tension-over-ukraine/

[Townsend]

Vanessa Angel's best movie.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

Just watched that the other night, needed a good laugh.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

Found a pic of Putin's father........

[Rookie Okie]

Are you serious? Palin has been all over this. Part of her "idiot" rap was her comment about Russia and the Ukraine from 2008--which turned out to be TRUE.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelpeck/2014/03/03/sarah-palin-was-right-about-ukraine/

Then there's this:

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/palin-obama-wears-mom-jeans

Who knew that CF and swake would be outed as closeted Palin-ites over this event, and I at this point really couldn't care. But I will enjoy watching her and and Romney gloat over their accuracy.

Please, SP just parroted one of the comebacks that she was given during her Sept 08' 2 week crash course which included (1). Basic History and Geography of the Contiguous 48 (2). Intro to World Affairs (3) Names and Places for 100 and (4). How to Whine Louder and Longer.

[swake]

The paper tiger has nuclear teeth.

No matter what his intensions are, you can be assured they will not play to our advantage.  I just pray that our president is willing to deliver more than lip-service.  Putin has Crimea and is not going to pull back.  Best we can hope for is to somehow keep him from using this victory as an excuse to take other former soviet properties under the premise that they are Russia's to take.

Putin is nothing but ego and action.  On the contrary, Kerry's comment on Sunday pretty much sums up the amazing diplomacy skills he brings to the table. "Invasion is not the act of someone who is strong. It is the act of someone who is weak."  I'm sure this really made Putin think about his life, and how he may have hurt people.

Don't you get it? This isn't Putin displaying strength, this is his dealing with failure, his weakness, and most of all, his fear. NATO and the West keep getting closer and closer to Moscow's doorstep. That's what the overthrow of the government in Ukraine means. His stupidly invading solidifies Ukraine's permanently allying with the West, and probably several other old Soviet countries too.

This isn't the powerlessness of the US and the West, this is the power of the US and the West. The frontier of US and NATO power in 1989 was Berlin, today more and more of what used to the Soviet Union itself becomes part of the West and NATO. Putin's dreams of resurrecting his empire are dead. And he's pissed off about it.

In the real world, from what I have read the dominant naval force in the Black Sea is Turkey, which of course is part of NATO. Also, the brand new US aircraft carrier George HW Bush and it's carrier group just entered the Med. If Russia's navy isn't a match for the Turks, it's certainly no match for the carrier group AND the Turkish Navy. Add to that Turkey controlling access in and out of the Black Sea and if things do go south the Russian Black Sea Fleet is in a really bad situation. They may be able to intimidate Ukraine's little Navy, but they aren't really strong.

[AquaMan]

Are you serious? Palin has been all over this. Part of her "idiot" rap was her comment about Russia and the Ukraine from 2008--which turned out to be TRUE.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelpeck/2014/03/03/sarah-palin-was-right-about-ukraine/

Then there's this:

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/palin-obama-wears-mom-jeans

Who knew that CF and swake would be outed as closeted Palin-ites over this event, and I at this point really couldn't care. But I will enjoy watching her and and Romney gloat over their accuracy.

You're getting to be as much giggles as Gas. Did you read anything but the headline of that story?...."Regardless of whether Palin had ESP or was just a broken clock that happened to tell the correct time, postulating that a forceful U.S. response to Russia during the brief 2008 Russia-Georgia War would have deterred Moscow from attacking Ukraine today, is as unlikely a scenario as imagining that then-Senator Obama could have changed U.S. policy.

In 2008, the U.S. military was stretched like a rubber band, trying to fight simultaneous wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. George W. Bush's White House, which could hardly be described as shy about using force, didn't have the resources for another conflict, and every U.S. President – Republican or Democrat – has trod very carefully in any situation that might put American troops in a shooting war with a nuclear-armed Russia. The Bush administration did ship humanitarian aid to Georgia, Western Europe criticized Russia, and that was all. Jimmy Carter ordered the U.S. to boycott the  1980 Olympics over the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, and Russian troops stayed in that country  another 10 years.


Perhaps the biggest lesson of the Russia-Georgia conflict was that it is dangerous for Russia's smaller neighbors to think of joining NATO, as Georgia hoped to do,  which Ukraine has flirted with, and which the three small Baltic states of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania have actually done. Regardless of what Senator Obama said in 2008 or President Obama did today, Russia would protect what it perceives as its vital interests.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

Regardless of what Senator Obama said in 2008 or President Obama did today, Russia would protect what it perceives as its vital interests.

And that's what they are doing. If they lose Ukraine and Crimea, they will be a land locked country with out a port, and those two countries could kick the Russian Navy out. Also the former Eastern Block countries want to have their own trade with the west and have access to hard currency.

[nathanm]

If they lose Ukraine and Crimea, they will be a land locked country with out a port

Russia proper also borders the Black Sea. The Black Sea Fleet is based in Crimea for historical reasons. Plans were to move it before 2042 when the current lease expires anyway. It also has coastlines on the Baltic Sea, the Arctic Sea, and the Pacific Ocean. They are not land-locked by any means, with or without Ukraine.

Taking over Crimea does conveniently bring a planned gas pipeline under complete Russian control, however. Perhaps Putin doesn't want gas from Georgia to have a way around Russia to Europe?

[Red Arrow]

Perhaps Putin doesn't want gas from Georgia to have a way around Russia to Europe?

Putin must have been watching James Bond movies.

[Conan71]

I just appreciate all of you sharing your Google searches to keep me informed on this conflict.

Cheers!

[Rookie Okie]

That's always been the USSR/Russia's strongest weapon.  Only after the cold war was over did we finally realize how much of the USSR's armament was bluff and bluster. 

C Yes, propaganda has been their trump card.  However, I just wonder if it will be effective as effective in 2014 as it was in the 50's - 70's/80's when it was fueled by total intimidation and fear of harm.  My sense is that should Russia immerse itself in a major external conflict and if/or there are heavy economic sanctions imposed upon the country, it becomes more fertile for internal strife and insurrection.  The military can't fight elsewhere and effectively police/ control (beat the smoot out of) their citizens at the same time.  The time may be near when Putin and his ilk can no longer expect that the masses will remain so sheepish under what they know is corrupt, rogue, and disingenuous leadership.

[guido911]

You're getting to be as much giggles as Gas. Did you read anything but the headline of that story?...."Regardless of whether Palin had ESP or was just a broken clock that happened to tell the correct time, postulating that a forceful U.S. response to Russia during the brief 2008 Russia-Georgia War would have deterred Moscow from attacking Ukraine today, is as unlikely a scenario as imagining that then-Senator Obama could have changed U.S. policy.

In 2008, the U.S. military was stretched like a rubber band, trying to fight simultaneous wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. George W. Bush's White House, which could hardly be described as shy about using force, didn't have the resources for another conflict, and every U.S. President – Republican or Democrat – has trod very carefully in any situation that might put American troops in a shooting war with a nuclear-armed Russia. The Bush administration did ship humanitarian aid to Georgia, Western Europe criticized Russia, and that was all. Jimmy Carter ordered the U.S. to boycott the  1980 Olympics over the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, and Russian troops stayed in that country  another 10 years.


Perhaps the biggest lesson of the Russia-Georgia conflict was that it is dangerous for Russia's smaller neighbors to think of joining NATO, as Georgia hoped to do,  which Ukraine has flirted with, and which the three small Baltic states of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania have actually done. Regardless of what Senator Obama said in 2008 or President Obama did today, Russia would protect what it perceives as its vital interests.

Did you read the article, or who wrote it, and what the author was defending? Please aqua, don't lead with your chin with me....

[guido911]

Obama getting ripped on by Iran now?

http://www.timesofisrael.com/iranian-general-obamas-threats-are-the-joke-of-the-year/#ixzz2v1bF22DF