Urban 8

[BuiltRight]

Part of the problem with "affordable" housing inside the IDL is any location that is in a active district (Blue Dome, Brady, ect) the land is going for about a $1,000,000+ an acre. So in the case of Urban 8 (I don't know what they paid for their land) that adds $120,000 to the price before you ever start building the condo.

I also have some hesitation when I see the numbers from The Village at Central Park, I really question what they will get them built for. the Urban 8 started out as a $400,000 - $500,000 unit price project.

[Conan71]

That is the question of the year for Urban 8. Rumors are that zero have been sold. The developer has "purchased" 1 and the other has been shown as "SOLD" for the illusion that there is a limited supply.

The fact that they are this close to completion and have not sold any is very bad news for them. Another rumor is that the market will only allow for ~$500,000 homes in the area. When I first saw the price I doubted if any would sell (thinking they probably have room to budge). Apparently they have no room to budge and it is sell at $875k+ or go under. Even now, a year and a few months later, the area is still a little too underdeveloped for those rich enough for a million dollar home. After a few more things finish up, it will feel a lot nicer and more gentrified so that the premium shoppers could buy in.

Why can't anyone build AFFORDABLE condos downtown? (i.e. in the $100k-$300k range) Not even 1 single new place? Can anyone explain why?

Once the bank gets them back then they will become affordable.

[cannon_fodder]

Each of the Urban 8 units occupies .07 acres, or 3200 square feet of land. The reported sale value (to the assessors office) is $34,000 per lot, which equates to about $500k per acre. So even if they are illegally reporting half the value and the real value they paid is $1mil per acre, it still equates to only $68,000 per lot. A far cry from $120k... what people may ask for land/lots and what it actually sells for are often very different things  (see, e.g., the lot on 7th, 1.6 acres listed at $1mil).

And, for whatever its worth, I see 5 Urban 8 lofts listed at the moment:
http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Downtown-Tulsa_Tulsa_OK

and they are gorgeous:
http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/613-E-3rd-St_Tulsa_OK_74120_M86142-49568

But $250 a square is a top price point here.

Hopefully that means movement. Tough price point in Tulsa, since the alternative may be 3 acres and a McMansion. Kind of surprised the higher priced units aren't trying to deliver a small patch of yard for a dog, a grill, or whatever. Just a 10 x 30 patch of grass out back.

[TulsaGoldenHurriCAN]

Part of the problem with "affordable" housing inside the IDL is any location that is in a active district (Blue Dome, Brady, ect) the land is going for about a $1,000,000+ an acre. So in the case of Urban 8 (I don't know what they paid for their land) that adds $120,000 to the price before you ever start building the condo.

I also have some hesitation when I see the numbers from The Village at Central Park, I really question what they will get them built for. the Urban 8 started out as a $400,000 - $500,000 unit price project.

If they started with $400-$500k, they should've stuck with that. The obvious solution is to put multiple units in a building and charge less or make them less square feet per unit. $250/sq foot is top of the market.

As cannon_fodder said, It should actually be $34k-$68k per unit for just the land so that leaves $332k-$466k to work with for each unit (excluding profit) which is quite a bit to work with for a nice sizeable house. The developer must have been stubborn about design and amenities which I understand, but they should've either sold at least a few or done the market research to make sure you can sell at the price point they need to break even and make profit.

[TulsaGoldenHurriCAN]

And, for whatever its worth, I see 5 Urban 8 lofts listed at the moment:
http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Downtown-Tulsa_Tulsa_OK

and they are gorgeous:
http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/613-E-3rd-St_Tulsa_OK_74120_M86142-49568

But $250 a square is a top price point here.

Hopefully that means movement. Tough price point in Tulsa, since the alternative may be 3 acres and a McMansion. Kind of surprised the higher priced units aren't trying to deliver a small patch of yard for a dog, a grill, or whatever. Just a 10 x 30 patch of grass out back.

They are gorgeous! They look great on the outside and have extremely nice spacious interiors. They no doubt put lots of money into making these top-notch. Perhaps they are a bit too nice and spacious.

Besides a mcmansion, check out what you can get in midtown for $700-$900k:
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1244-E-26th-St-Tulsa-OK-74114/22174882_zpid/

http://www.zillow.com/homes/for_sale/700000-950000_price/2596-3524_mp/globalrelevanceex_sort/36.149554,-95.914207,36.08743,-96.004157_rect/13_zm/0_mmm/

I love urban life and would love to live downtown, but if faced with the options of the above house on 26th or Urban 8, it would be very hard to turn down such a stately manor with an outdoor oasis in the prime historical neighborhood of Tulsa.

Nevertheless, we can only hope they sell for that and this helps pave the way for more downtown homes/condos.

[Tulsa Zephyr]

My wife and I did the downtown residential tour of some of the downtown residential offerings recently, including Urban 8 lofts, which, though beautiful, we thought they were overpriced especially after noticing the huge construction going on to the North (The Edge) right next to them.  Who would want to pay $875,000 and end up with a view like that?  Most of the other dwellings on the tour seemed to be pretty reasonable (though not nearly as nice as the Urban but I'm thinking it's going to be a while before that price point is acceptable to folks looking to move downtown, unless and until the other Nelson-involved developments are closer to completion...

[Red Arrow]

A lot of the older homes were built when it was cheaper to buy natural gas than insulation.  Be Careful.

[Conan71]

If I heard correctly, Yvonne Hovell, previously of East Tulsa Dodge, is the owner or developer.  Others associated with the project are James Boswell Architecture and the Holston Group.

Doing some googling around you find the following:

"Urban 8 is a joint venture between Hovell, West Construction, the Holston Group and architect James Boswell. Hovell owned Yvonne Hovell Dodge Chrysler Jeep of Tulsa before selling it to Oklahoma City-based Bob Moore Auto Group two years ago."

Looking at the HBA of Tulsa web site, Yvonne Hovell is the contact for the Holston Group.

If you ask me it might be an inexperienced developer or someone living in their own world who assumes the line would be extraordinarily long for an $800K plus home in downtown Tulsa.  

Personally, if I could afford that much home, I would not be looking for something crowded in that tight with my neighbors.  I also wouldn't be spending that money in Tulsa.  I could buy a pretty neat place in the BVI's, Colorado, or New Mexico without a neighbor closer than an acre away.  

If they thought retirees were a viable market for them, I'm not sure how many retirees are looking for four story town houses without an elevator.  Most of us will have trouble with stairs as we get older, it's an immutable fact of life unless those retirees are 30 year old internet millionaires.

[Red Arrow]

I could buy a pretty neat place in the BVI's, Colorado, or New Mexico without a neighbor closer than an acre away.  

You had better get more land than that. My new across the street neighbors added a big ugly privacy fence to the view out my front window.

[saintnicster]

Part of the problem with "affordable" housing inside the IDL is any location that is in a active district (Blue Dome, Brady, ect) the land is going for about a $1,000,000+ an acre. So in the case of Urban 8 (I don't know what they paid for their land) that adds $120,000 to the price before you ever start building the condo.

I also have some hesitation when I see the numbers from The Village at Central Park, I really question what they will get them built for. the Urban 8 started out as a $400,000 - $500,000 unit price project.

Weren't the Arco Building condos going to be in the $200k range (back in 2008ish) before that fell through?

[Tulsa Zephyr]

If they thought retirees were a viable market for them, I'm not sure how many retirees are looking for four story town houses without an elevator.  Most of us will have trouble with stairs as we get older, it's an immutable fact of life unless those retirees are 30 year old internet millionaires.

FYI...The Urban 8 townhomes actually do have an elevator.  Still not worth $875,000 IMO...

[DowntownDan]

They are gorgeous! They look great on the outside and have extremely nice spacious interiors. They no doubt put lots of money into making these top-notch. Perhaps they are a bit too nice and spacious.

Besides a mcmansion, check out what you can get in midtown for $700-$900k:
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1244-E-26th-St-Tulsa-OK-74114/22174882_zpid/

http://www.zillow.com/homes/for_sale/700000-950000_price/2596-3524_mp/globalrelevanceex_sort/36.149554,-95.914207,36.08743,-96.004157_rect/13_zm/0_mmm/

I love urban life and would love to live downtown, but if faced with the options of the above house on 26th or Urban 8, it would be very hard to turn down such a stately manor with an outdoor oasis in the prime historical neighborhood of Tulsa.

Nevertheless, we can only hope they sell for that and this helps pave the way for more downtown homes/condos.

Yeah, considering what you can buy in midtown for the same price, the price for these is way out there.  You also can't live a true "urban life" yet from that location considering there are no grocery or drug stores in walking distance.  You'd actually have to drive farther from downtown to the closest grocery store (Reasor's at 15th and Lewis?) than from midtown itself.  I hope there is a market for these because I'd hate to have something like this fail and dissuade further development.

[heironymouspasparagus]

You had better get more land than that. My new across the street neighbors added a big ugly privacy fence to the view out my front window.

Sounds like a front yard privacy fence....is that allowed in your neighborhood?  I thought it was against covenants there....at least the one guy I knew who lived in that area said so...?

[SXSW]

Yeah, considering what you can buy in midtown for the same price, the price for these is way out there.  You also can't live a true "urban life" yet from that location considering there are no grocery or drug stores in walking distance.  You'd actually have to drive farther from downtown to the closest grocery store (Reasor's at 15th and Lewis?) than from midtown itself.  I hope there is a market for these because I'd hate to have something like this fail and dissuade further development.

I doubt it will dissuade further development but most of what we'll see downtown will be rentals and not for-purchase.

[Conan71]

It is pretty cool heading west on 3rd St. at Peoria to see Urban 8 on the horizon.  I just hope they fill it.