Why some major retailers pick Tulsa over Oklahoma City

[beedubaya]

Tulsa benefits because its a much more compact city.  Retailers like a high level of income within a concentrated area and that's easy in Tulsa.  In OKC, it's more difficult because there are numerous wealthy enclaves scattered throughout the sprawl.  The money is here, but its a hard sell to retailers when it doesn't fit into their usual formula for deciding locations.  Tulsa also is a larger retail market despite being a smaller metropolitan area due to the fact eastern Oklahoma is much more populated than western Oklahoma.  I also think Tulsa avoid's some of the negative Oklahoma stereotypes that get associated with OKC for better or for worse.

I doubt "big city feel" has much to do with it since Costco is going into Wichita and that has way less "big city feel" than Tulsa or OKC.

[Oil Capital]

Tulsa benefits because its a much more compact city.  Retailers like a high level of income within a concentrated area and that's easy in Tulsa.  In OKC, it's more difficult because there are numerous wealthy enclaves scattered throughout the sprawl.  The money is here, but its a hard sell to retailers when it doesn't fit into their usual formula for deciding locations.  Tulsa also is a larger retail market despite being a smaller metropolitan area due to the fact eastern Oklahoma is much more populated than western Oklahoma.  I also think Tulsa avoid's some of the negative Oklahoma stereotypes that get associated with OKC for better or for worse.

I doubt "big city feel" has much to do with it since Costco is going into Wichita and that has way less "big city feel" than Tulsa or OKC.

By what measure is the Tulsa retail market larger than OKC's?  

Here are the retail number for the two metro areas for this year, according to the Center for Economic & Management Research at OU's Price College of Business:

Date    Area    TOTAL
RETAIL TRADE
OKC (Metro population:  1,336,767)
1/2015    OKLAHOMA CITY MSA    $1,182,220,332   $884.39 per capita
2/2015    OKLAHOMA CITY MSA    $1,158,902,885
3/2015    OKLAHOMA CITY MSA    $1,181,098,101
4/2015    OKLAHOMA CITY MSA    $1,180,700,354
5/2015    OKLAHOMA CITY MSA    $1,228,299,725
6/2015    OKLAHOMA CITY MSA    $1,226,039,917   $917.17 per capita

Tulsa (Metro population:  969,224)
1/2015    TULSA MSA    $824,431,172   $850.61 per capita
2/2015    TULSA MSA    $809,453,506
3/2015    TULSA MSA    $835,862,202
4/2015    TULSA MSA    $826,969,855
5/2015    TULSA MSA    $851,818,521
6/2015    TULSA MSA    $849,340,048   $904.30 per capita

http://origins.ou.edu/  http://www.ou.edu/content/price/centersresearch/cemr/cemr_data.html

[Breadburner]

Tulsa>Okc.....

[carltonplace]

Tulsa>Okc.....

That equation can't be denied. It's simple math.
Tulsa > OKC = suck it.

[glove51]

Went to H&M in Manhattan a couple of years ago.  Thought it was awful.  Think of Forever 21 for a slightly older demo.

[Conan71]

If Tulsa's demographics and economics are on the radar list of "cool" retailers, we really should have no problem dictating to those developers better construction principles we should expect from their developments in Tulsa rather than settling for more layup concrete dreck and an over-abundance of surface parking.

[Townsend]

If Tulsa's demographics and economics are on the radar list of "cool" retailers, we really should have no problem dictating to those developers better construction principles we should expect from their developments in Tulsa rather than settling for more layup concrete dreck and an over-abundance of surface parking.

But we don't.  Without some major changes, we won't.

[Conan71]

But we don't.  Without some major changes, we won't.

If we could elect an administration with some real vision rather than troglodytes we'd be all good.

[Townsend]

If we could elect an administration with some real vision rather than troglodytes we'd be all good.

Well yeah...but how will that get done?

Jesus, Simonson is still in a position of power.

[beedubaya]

By what measure is the Tulsa retail market larger than OKC's?  

Tulsa's trade area is larger.  Eastern Oklahoma is much more populated than western Oklahoma.  That matters for destination retailers like Costco.  Second, Tulsa's wealth is concentrated while OKC's is spread out in different pockets across the metro.  It doesn't matter if there really is more wealth in OKC, retailers look for concentrated wealth.  Tulsa has it and OKC doesn't.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

Tulsa's trade area is larger.  Eastern Oklahoma is much more populated than western Oklahoma.  That matters for destination retailers like Costco.  Second, Tulsa's wealth is concentrated while OKC's is spread out in different pockets across the metro.  It doesn't matter if there really is more wealth in OKC, retailers look for concentrated wealth.  Tulsa has it and OKC doesn't.

I kind of have to call BS on the COSTCO comments, where they open stores based on population density and wealth/population is not true. As an example, there is a COSTCO in Roseburg Oregon which has a population of 22,000 people, and Douglas County has a population of  106,000. Taking into account the surrounding counties, you are still looking at less than 500,000 people. If you want an affluent county, you can go to Monterey County, in California where the two largest areas are Monterey and Salinas, (picture Monterey as Tulsa without the bay, and Salinas is McAlester including a state prison) with a total of 456,000 people they have two COSTCO's, one in Monterey and one in Salinas, they are roughly 20 miles apart, and just north of there in Santa Cruz and Santa Cruz County which is 262,000 people there is a COSTCO there as well.

The problem with getting a COSTCO in Oklahoma has been they have their own vineyard and winery and sell their private label wines in their stores. In Oregon this is not a problem as they can sell wine and real beer in their stores while liquor is sold in state stores, and in other states like California and Arizona state laws allow the sale of wine, real beer, and liquor in grocery style stores.

Also in Oregon, there are COSTCO locations in Medford, Eugene/Springfield, Albany, Salem, and Bend which most of these are somewhat smaller areas than the Tulsa metro area. Sorry, I did not include the Portland/Vancouver area that people love to compare Tulsa to, there are seven COSTCO locations.

[Conan71]

I kind of have to call BS on the COSTCO comments, where they open stores based on population density and wealth/population is not true. As an example, there is a COSTCO in Roseburg Oregon which has a population of 22,000 people, and Douglas County has a population of  106,000. Taking into account the surrounding counties, you are still looking at less than 500,000 people. If you want an affluent county, you can go to Monterey County, in California where the two largest areas are Monterey and Salinas, (picture Monterey as Tulsa without the bay, and Salinas is McAlester including a state prison) with a total of 456,000 people they have two COSTCO's, one in Monterey and one in Salinas, they are roughly 20 miles apart, and just north of there in Santa Cruz and Santa Cruz County which is 262,000 people there is a COSTCO there as well.

The problem with getting a COSTCO in Oklahoma has been they have their own vineyard and winery and sell their private label wines in their stores. In Oregon this is not a problem as they can sell wine and real beer in their stores while liquor is sold in state stores, and in other states like California and Arizona state laws allow the sale of wine, real beer, and liquor in grocery style stores.

Also in Oregon, there are COSTCO locations in Medford, Eugene/Springfield, Albany, Salem, and Bend which most of these are somewhat smaller areas than the Tulsa metro area. Sorry, I did not include the Portland/Vancouver area that people love to compare Tulsa to, there are seven COSTCO locations.

Someone told me Trader Joe's is working around our laws by having a liquor store built adjacent to their new market which can sell Three Buck Chuck.  At least, that's what I've heard.  Seems COSTCO could do the same thing.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

Someone told me Trader Joe's is working around our laws by having a liquor store built adjacent to their new market which can sell Three Buck Chuck.  At least, that's what I've heard.  Seems COSTCO could do the same thing.

Didn't I read here sometime  ago that COSTCO was going to do something similar?

[swake]

Didn't I read here sometime  ago that COSTCO was going to do something similar?

What I heard was they contracted with a local person to "own" the liquor store attached to Costco.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

What I heard was they contracted with a local person to "own" the liquor store attached to Costco.

Maybe that was it, anything to protect the children from seeing such evil and vile things.