Iron Gate

[rebound]

DT, Its their mission. Consider that they are charged with feeding, clothing, aiding the less fortunate. Not judging whether they are mentally ill, physically unfit, drug addicted or unwilling to learn or work. It is a biblical mission. Social work is a different mission that may have its origins in religion but is primarily a betterment effort. Thus Salvation Army and Iron Gate are saving souls and doing the Lord's work. Family and Children's Services and other quasi-government organizations are trying to manage these deficits and help rebuild broken lives.

That's what I mean by the difficulty of having organizations with different funding for their missions come together in a cohesive effort.

Interesting.  On that line, I'd put this up for discussion.  I have friend of mine who is fond of the saying "don't feed the bears" as it relates to reducing panhandling and the like.  If as you say (and I agree with you) the religious-based organizations are simply concerned with aiding the less fortunate (and not in actually addressing any of the root problems) could we argue that they are simply abetting unwanted and/or unproductive behaviors?  If so, then the denial of the Iron Gate move and expansion seems prudent.  

[heironymouspasparagus]

Exactly.

It's far more expensive to support someone on the streets. It's more cost effective and much more humane to HOUSE them. Keep them safe, give them access to services to help them get better.

What DTowner said....


Salvation Army is one of those places where one can get room and board just by walking in the door and asking.  BUT - there are conditions - the person(s) must be making an effort to make changes to the situation/conditions that got them there in the first place.  Like DT said, many don't want to change.

So what does housing consist of??  Just build a few dwelling places and let people move in with no conditions/oversight ?  What would be the rules?  No rules?  That rapidly slides into situations like Opium dens and Cabrini Green.

Can't get much easier than the SA in theory - just stay clean/dry (drug and alcohol) and bath regularly.  Don't get into fights and start a plan to get yourself back on your feet.  The problem is, many aren't ready to make that effort.  How do you 'help' them?  Can't get there from here - has to be something additional to address the mental issues so many face who are in that situation - we seem to have the wrong mix to the services you mention.  We as a society have failed in that...basically since the 'git-go'.

[rdj]

Someone who falls in the chronic homeless category can't be "fixed" overnight.  It is a long process that can take many months or even years.  Which is why the need for day centers and soup kitchen/food pantries will always have a need.  It should also be noted that many of those served by Iron Gate are not homeless.  In fact from my conversations with their staff they have many a downtown worker that visits for groceries.  For whatever reason that week or month they are short on cash and choose to pay rent or car payment and then can get assistance with food. 

I would disagree that the traditionally "faith-based" organizations don't work with the "state-sponsored" organizations.  From my experience with Family & Children's Services, Mental Health Association and John 3:16 the staff and senior management of those organizations work very well together.  From my perspective/experience the top social service agencies in Tulsa work together very well.

[heironymouspasparagus]

DT, Its their mission. Consider that they are charged with feeding, clothing, aiding the less fortunate. Not judging whether they are mentally ill, physically unfit, drug addicted or unwilling to learn or work. It is a biblical mission. Social work is a different mission that may have its origins in religion but is primarily a betterment effort. Thus Salvation Army and Iron Gate are saving souls and doing the Lord's work. Family and Children's Services and other quasi-government organizations are trying to manage these deficits and help rebuild broken lives.

That's what I mean by the difficulty of having organizations with different funding for their missions come together in a cohesive effort.

Salvation Army does quite a bit more than just feeding/clothing people.  They take people in at the shelter and help them get connected to other services related to rehab, job training, etc.  I worked with several downtown shelter residents for a few years when I was in town more, and these guys had decided to make the change and go a different direction.  They were moving back into mainstream life.

[cannon_fodder]

From my conversation with people who have worked full time for Iron Gate, their advertised client based of 75%-25% is likely inverted in reality. With the vast majority of their soup kitchen clientele being homeless.  Their food pantry is the exact opposite, if you are homeless, having food that needs to be stored/cooked doesn't do you a lot of good.

rdj:
I truly think the housing would have less resistance than the soup kitchen.  A soup kitchen, by its very nature, attracts transients. The people who will utilize it the most are the chronically homeless who either don't want help or can't live up to the expectations to get it. The housing solutions are, most often, nicer than other free-market apartments across the area. They set standards and maintain them.  I know I'd be more comfortable with such a place in my neighborhood over a food kitchen.

Aquaman:
Child and Family Services took over an existing medical building and totally renovated it. It is bordered by a large commercial structure (medical) and a retail development.  There are not hundreds of people walking to and hanging out around there everyday (or ever). The only people outside the structure I ever see are waiting on the bus or walking by (and I don't think most of them are coming or going to that service). They focus on services to children, a completely different client base.  The only negative effect of that building is the addition of yet another bus stop on Harvard (6 per mile) and a pedestrian trigger stop light (there are now stop lights at 41st, 36th, 31st, 27th, 26th, 25th, 24th, and 21st).


On the bigger issue, I'd be very interested in hearing from a social worker/scientist who has studied the most effective ways of dealing with homelessness. I understand handouts are the easiest and most "Christian" way of facing the problem, but it isn't a solution.  Mental health, economic opportunity, addiction counseling, and housing - there is a lot to deal with. Just curious.

[carltonplace]

We can always try the Oklahoma City method.

http://www.ibtimes.com/homeless-bus-ticket-programs-across-nation-offer-little-accountability-poor-housing-2016812
For years, Oklahoma City tackled its homeless problem by handing out bus tickets to other cities to its down-and-out residents.

I bet if you polled folks arriving at the Grey hound station that would find this practice is still happening in other cities.

[Breadburner]

http://www.newson6.com/story/30305841/multiple-drug-overdoses-reported-at-downtown-tulsa-soup-kitchen

[TulsaGoldenHurriCAN]

Nothing to see hear! This doesn't affect nearby businesses, well-being or safety of the neighborhood at all!

/Sarcasm tag might be needed

[sgrizzle]

Nothing to see hear! This doesn't affect nearby businesses, well-being or safety of the neighborhood at all!

/Sarcasm tag might be needed

My office is next door. My well-being and safety are unphased.

[Townsend]

My office is next door. My well-being and safety are unphased.

Dude...you are so high right now

[cannon_fodder]

My office is next door. My well-being and safety are unphased.

Then again - you don't live there, own the building, or spend much time coming or going.

"At least" 9 people overdosed. That means at least 9 people were on some drug dangerous enough to cause an overdose (that is, not just stoned). Unfortunately, a symptom of the situation many of the clientele find themselves in is drug use. Another is alcoholism. Another is crime.

Justifiable NIMBY.

Iron Gate was in the paper again over the weekend. An intriguing photo was taken of a man walking to Iron Gate wrapped in a sheet. Really an amazing photo. The guy was released from David L. Moss and was heading to Iron Gate, as he was taken to David L. Moss in just shorts...that's what he left in. They gave him the sheet to keep warm as it was ~50 degrees.

But once again, not a great advertisement for a neighborhood asset.

[TulsaGoldenHurriCAN]

My office is next door. My well-being and safety are unphased.

I am so happy your well-being and safety were unphased! We are all so happy for you! Congrats! You earn a golden star!
Nevertheless, having more people doing drugs around where you live and work will statistically increase the likelihood of bad things happening (crime, robberies and incidents like this one). Do some research. Drug addicts commit more crimes.

They had to shut a street down for medical personnel for this! Who is paying for all of that health care? Not the ones getting the care. Furthermore that takes the medical personnel away from other calls. Other people could've died and likely had delayed help because so many ambulances were called to help a bunch of people who OD'd.

Futhermore a 12 year old was one of those! And it was at 9am! How messed up could a situation possibly be and some will act like this is "no big deal because I am not personally affected!"

[sgrizzle]

Futhermore a 12 year old was one of those! And it was at 9am! How messed up could a situation possibly be and some will act like this is "no big deal because I am not personally affected!"

I didn't say it was a big deal, but people getting high across the street at work affects me about as much as the house of TU students who were stoned nightly across the street from my house.

having more people doing drugs around where you live and work will statistically increase the likelihood of bad things happening

See also Colorado.

If iron gate wasn't dealing with a bunch of half-dressed people hanging out in a parking lot because their building is too small this would help prevent it too. Homeless or not, you have a bunch of people milling around in a parking lot for hours, dumb things will happen. See any high school.

[Breadburner]

I didn't say it was a big deal, but people getting high across the street at work affects me about as much as the house of TU students who were stoned nightly across the street from my house.


See also Colorado.

If iron gate wasn't dealing with a bunch of half-dressed people hanging out in a parking lot because their building is too small this would help prevent it too. Homeless or not, you have a bunch of people milling around in a parking lot for hours, dumb things will happen. See any high school.

So them overdosing inside would be better.....

[swake]

I didn't say it was a big deal, but people getting high across the street at work affects me about as much as the house of TU students who were stoned nightly across the street from my house.


See also Colorado.

If iron gate wasn't dealing with a bunch of half-dressed people hanging out in a parking lot because their building is too small this would help prevent it too. Homeless or not, you have a bunch of people milling around in a parking lot for hours, dumb things will happen. See any high school.

Actual pot =/= this "synthetic marijuana" crap