PAC Trust selects developer

[shavethewhales]

Wow, this is hugely exciting. Rarely do we see the renderings improve this dramatically, especially this late in the process. It seems like a wildly bullish gamble on downtown housing, but I assume the tide is really starting to turn in that favor.

[Laramie]

Looks good. Looks like a hotel and condos.

Question though, is the First Place Tower melting in the second photo?

Awesome, this will be a great get for Tulsa. Glad to see development in both of Oklahoma's two largest cities.  An exciting time for Tulsa, my son lives in T-town, I plan to send him these pics.

[TheArtist]

Looks good. Looks like a hotel and condos.

Question though, is the First Place Tower melting in the second photo?

Looks like someone wasn't paying attention when using the Photoshop "magic eraser" tool.   But yea, will be amazed if this development actually happens.

[Oil Capital]

Looks like someone wasn't paying attention when using the Photoshop "magic eraser" tool.   But yea, will be amazed if this development actually happens.

That's pretty funny.  And in the first photo, the residential tower seems to be floating in midair.

[SXSW]

I'm all for ambitious developments like this but hope this is not simply a placeholder for something that isn't actually feasible.  I agree this site deserves a high quality project with some height and density but if it's a 12 story apartment tower and starts next year I'd take that over a 21 story tower that doesn't start for several years or ever.  I remember the last time Tulsa had a 20+ story residential tower proposed at 21st & Main in the early 2000's..

And I do hope a grocery can still be part of this development, that is absolutely key to creating more residential density in the area.  3rd St needs retail activation, less so on Cincinnati, Detroit and 2nd but there should be something at the corner of 2nd & Detroit.

This F&C project in Cincinnati looks great: http://flco.com/company-properties/4thandrace/

[ELG4America]

Did anyone get a response from Flaherty & Collins?

[SXSW]

I saw this pic on FB from St Paddy's Day taken from the rooftop bar at the Indigo.  Made me think how much better this view would be with this development taking over that huge parking lot.  Fingers crossed this one can get off the ground, and hopefully will still include a full service grocery store.

[AdamsHall]

I saw this pic on FB from St Paddy's Day taken from the rooftop bar at the Indigo.  Made me think how much better this view would be with this development taking over that huge parking lot.  Fingers crossed this one can get off the ground, and hopefully will still include a full service grocery store.

Cosentino's in KC's Power & Light District would be a nice grocery store addition.

[Oil Capital]

Soooo... is this officially dead, or what?

[shavethewhales]

^What, just because nothing has been mentioned in a few months? Some of these projects drag on for years before they get off the ground.

Last I heard, there was some infrastructure planning and relocation going on in relation to this, so the wheels are turning. I don't know if any actual work has started, but someone was requesting some information that passed through my office, so someone is out there working on at least getting it ready.

I feel like Tulsa likes to check things off one at a time rather than having too much going on at once, both on the city side and in terms of individual developers. There are still a lot of outstanding proposals that need to get off the ground, and slowly but surely they are getting started. The infrastructure work that has been going on down Archer is a big deal, and I'm sure the city wants that wrapped up before starting on any other big nearby projects that will require ripping up the street. The hoteliers that rushed in all at once to announce new projects years ago seem to have been letting them go up one at a time so that demand is not overwhelmed.

[DTowner]

The continued slow and steady pace of downtown development is pretty good in light of the flat to slightly negative population growth in Tulsa proper the past few years.  We are simply not growing in population sufficiently to support a large number of residential/commercial developments at once.  Better to build at the absorption rate than create a saturated market leading to failed projects, bankruptcies and foreclosures. 

The PAC project seems like just another in a list of projects that are slow walking to inconclusive outcomes in hopes of not getting too far in front of the market.

It is frustrating to me, however, that all of the positive development and momentum of the past decade have not yet resulted in jump starting a period of significant population growth and attendant development.  Maybe it's coming, but for now we seem stuck in first gear.

[SXSW]

It is frustrating to me, however, that all of the positive development and momentum of the past decade have not yet resulted in jump starting a period of significant population growth and attendant development.  Maybe it's coming, but for now we seem stuck in first gear.

I think the city has laid a good foundation for future growth, and obviously has had some major support from local philanthropic organizations like GKFF.  Downtown looks better than it has in 40+ years.  Now it's really up to the private sector to provide the type of job growth that allows the city to grow at a faster rate.  Tulsa has always had a robust small business economy in all kinds of sectors, that is where the growth will be going forward hopefully with a continued increase in technology and research/engineering type jobs.  Oil and gas will remain a big part of the local economy and will ebb and flow with that sector, similar to how it also affects OKC and Houston (Midland is way more dependent).

[Oil Capital]

^What, just because nothing has been mentioned in a few months? Some of these projects drag on for years before they get off the ground.

Last I heard, there was some infrastructure planning and relocation going on in relation to this, so the wheels are turning. I don't know if any actual work has started, but someone was requesting some information that passed through my office, so someone is out there working on at least getting it ready.

I feel like Tulsa likes to check things off one at a time rather than having too much going on at once, both on the city side and in terms of individual developers. There are still a lot of outstanding proposals that need to get off the ground, and slowly but surely they are getting started. The infrastructure work that has been going on down Archer is a big deal, and I'm sure the city wants that wrapped up before starting on any other big nearby projects that will require ripping up the street. The hoteliers that rushed in all at once to announce new projects years ago seem to have been letting them go up one at a time so that demand is not overwhelmed.

Well, yes, that and the fact there has been no official word in over a year, and the fact that it has not been on the PAC Trust's agenda since January (after having been on the agenda for every meeting since mid-2017). Oh, and the fact that by its own terms the contract with Flaherty & Collins expired some time ago.  An amendment was on the agenda once during 2018, but to my knowledge, the result of that meeting has never been reported.  So... it seemed pretty fair to ask if the project is dead.

[Rattle Trap]

I don't know if this has any significance with regards to this project, but when scrolling through Facebook this morning I saw Bynum post that the PAC Trust officially begins operations of the PAC today.

[MostSeriousness]

I would imagine that was a part of the holdup in the lot development - the PAC has been working on that transition for quite a while