President Trump- The Implications

[Cats Cats Cats]

A question to erfalf.

Do you think that the enemies of the American People should be able to operate freely in the United States?

[erfalf]

I never said he could.  I'm saying we need to, as McCain said, look to history.  Clairvoyant?  You only need to look as far back as Putin as I alluded to.

You are all either completely snowed by his competence (I doubt it) or live in a "the sky is falling" world 24/7.

Like I've said before, he is a duffus. Why all the credence to what he could or couldn't do? Has your faith in the bureaucracy gone from 100% to 0% purely due to a change at the top? Or is it that you fear the bureaucracy, but it was not trendy to say so last year? I'm really curious, because from my world view, the government will likely function pretty much as it has for the last 8/16/24 years. I have 0% faith that Trump will "make America Great Again".

[erfalf]

A question to erfalf.

Do you think that the enemies of the American People should be able to operate freely in the United States?

Who determines enemies? Are they American citizens or not? I know where you are headed, but you realize it is far more complicated than that.

And on that note, we technically don't let them operate abroad freely either. Just ask Trump's predecessor.

[Cats Cats Cats]

Who determines enemies? Are they American citizens or not? I know where you are headed, but you realize it is far more complicated than that.

And on that note, we technically don't let them operate abroad freely either. Just ask Trump's predecessor.

I would say that the President, Congress, NSA, FBI, homeland security could all determine people to be enemies of the American People.  So I didn't catch it. Are you for allowing enemies of the United States people to operate freely in the United States or not?  So you are for allowing American citizens who are enemies of the people to operate freely?  I mean you just arrest them and then let the so called judges decide if they are guilty of a crime right?

[heironymouspasparagus]

What McCain said and what Trump says about the press in my eyes are perfectly in line with each other, they both hate the press, But in yours one is heroic, and the other a dictator?

Please describe to me exactly how Trump has been hindering the "free press". I really would like to know. Presidents have long tried to control the press or release what they thought would best suit them. Trump is (STILL) not unique on this front. Roosevelt had polio, yet no one knew. Was he a dictator because he controlled the message (well, maybe a bad example)?

Everyone knew Roosevelt had polio - at least those who listened to real news instead of Faux News.  it was known from the git-go.  It just wasn't advertised and paraded about much.  Roosevelt tried hard to hide it so it wouldn't enter the discussion   Just think what the Murdoch Clown Show would do with that today.  And given Trump's proven track record on people with handicaps/disabilities, well one can only imagine how he would mock a polio victim.

[patric]

While in Florida yesterday during his 'rally' (hey Donny, you won...hasn't anyone told you this?) he alluded to some nefarious incident in Sweden happening.  From a Swedish media outlet, here is what they say happened in their country.

After the terrible terrorist attack in Sweden, they have finally come around to seeing it our way, and are now offering a solution finally.



http://www.the-postillon.com/2017/01/border-wall-ikea.html

[erfalf]

I would say that the President, Congress, NSA, FBI, homeland security could all determine people to be enemies of the American People.  So I didn't catch it. Are you for allowing enemies of the United States people to operate freely in the United States or not?  So you are for allowing American citizens who are enemies of the people to operate freely?  I mean you just arrest them and then let the so called judges decide if they are guilty of a crime right?

IF they are American citizens, and have been afforded due process, they can think whatever they want freely in this country.

That being said, I know our memories are short, but does no one recall the hostility Obama showed toward the media. I know it was rough for him getting called Hitler all the time and everything, but... wait what?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/blogs/ticket/obama-admin-spied-fox-news-reporter-james-rosen-134204299.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Department_of_Justice_investigations_of_reporters
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/justice-departments-scrutiny-of-fox-news-reporter-james-rosen-in-leak-case-draws-fire/2013/05/20/c6289eba-c162-11e2-8bd8-2788030e6b44_story.html?utm_term=.9c2e85ecd927
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2017/02/where_was_mccain_when_obama_attacked_the_free_press.html

[heironymouspasparagus]

IF they are American citizens, and have been afforded due process, they can think whatever they want freely in this country.

That being said, I know our memories are short, but does no one recall the hostility Obama showed toward the media. I know it was rough for him getting called Hitler all the time and everything, but... wait what?

Or the way Trump lied for 8+ years about a birth certificate....

[erfalf]

Or the way Trump lied for 8+ years about a birth certificate....

[rebound]

IF they are American citizens, and have been afforded due process, they can think whatever they want freely in this country.

That being said, I know our memories are short, but does no one recall the hostility Obama showed toward the media. I know it was rough for him getting called Hitler all the time and everything, but... wait what?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/blogs/ticket/obama-admin-spied-fox-news-reporter-james-rosen-134204299.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Department_of_Justice_investigations_of_reporters
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/justice-departments-scrutiny-of-fox-news-reporter-james-rosen-in-leak-case-draws-fire/2013/05/20/c6289eba-c162-11e2-8bd8-2788030e6b44_story.html?utm_term=.9c2e85ecd927
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2017/02/where_was_mccain_when_obama_attacked_the_free_press.html

You are still missing the difference.   Getting into fights with the press, saying they are biased, unfair, etc.,  is old hat.  Obama (rightly or wrongly, but more similar to what others had done before) targeted specific reporters, etc.   I'm not defending those actions, but that is a far cry from yelling "Fake News!" and attempting to slather ALL the press for the actions of some.  What Trump is to doing is impugning "the media" in general, telling his followers not to listen to any of them.  Just listen to him.

McCain is right on this one.   Most politicians, including McCain, absolutely can't stand the media but they understand the role it plays.  Trump doesn't. (Or, he does, and doesn't care. Which is even worse.)

[erfalf]

You are still missing the difference.   Getting into fights with the press, saying they are biased, unfair, etc.,  is old hat.  Obama (rightly or wrongly, but more similar to what others had done before) targeted specific reporters, etc.   I'm not defending those actions, but that is a far cry from yelling "Fake News!" and attempting to slather ALL the press for the actions of some.  What Trump is to doing is impugning "the media" in general, telling his followers not to listen to any of them.  Just listen to him.

McCain is right on this one.   Most politicians, including McCain, absolutely can't stand the media but they understand the role it plays.  Trump doesn't. (Or, he does, and doesn't care. Which is even worse.)

What Obama did on a nearly daily basis slandering Fox news and the "alt" news is exactly similar to what Trump is doing to the mainstream media today. Again, just much more eloquently done. He called Fox news stupid and misguided while not making it sound so insulting.

[swake]

What Obama did on a nearly daily basis slandering Fox news and the "alt" news is exactly similar to what Trump is doing to the mainstream media today. Again, just much more eloquently done. He called Fox news stupid and misguided while not making it sound so insulting.

Please provide some quotes for us to discuss that you feel are "exactly similar", k?

[erfalf]

Please provide some quotes for us to discuss that you feel are "exactly similar", k?

From a mouthpiece:

"We're going to treat them the way we would treat an opponent," said Anita Dunn, the White House communications director, in a telephone interview on Sunday. "As they are undertaking a war against Barack Obama and the White House, we don't need to pretend that this is the way that legitimate news organizations behave."

Sounds pretty familiar right?

Another mouthpiece:

http://www.politico.com/story/2009/10/fox-not-really-news-says-axelrod-028417

And straight from the horse's mouth (via Rolling Stone):

The golden age of an objective press was a pretty narrow span of time in our history. Before that, you had folks like Hearst who used their newspapers very intentionally to promote their viewpoints. I think Fox is part of that tradition — it is part of the tradition that has a very clear, undeniable point of view. It's a point of view that I disagree with. It's a point of view that I think is ultimately destructive for the long-term growth of a country that has a vibrant middle class and is competitive in the world.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/obama-in-command-br-the-rolling-stone-interview-20100928

Did you catch that populist dig, ie Fox is against the middle class, in other words "us".

And for what it's worth, at least the Times saw this coming and wasn't screeching about how Trump represented a threat to journalism. The big difference between Obama and Trump seems to be that Trump is a jack donkey to your face.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/30/opinion/sunday/if-donald-trump-targets-journalists-thank-obama.html

I find great irony that the same people who routinely used the term Faux News are now gravely concerned about the actual term Fake News. Ain't life fun.

[Hoss]

From a mouthpiece:

Sounds pretty familiar right?

Another mouthpiece:

http://www.politico.com/story/2009/10/fox-not-really-news-says-axelrod-028417

And straight from the horse's mouth (via Rolling Stone):

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/obama-in-command-br-the-rolling-stone-interview-20100928

Did you catch that populist dig, ie Fox is against the middle class, in other words "us".

And for what it's worth, at least the Times saw this coming and wasn't screeching about how Trump represented a threat to journalism. The big difference between Obama and Trump seems to be that Trump is a jack donkey to your face.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/30/opinion/sunday/if-donald-trump-targets-journalists-thank-obama.html

I find great irony that the same people who routinely used the term Faux News are now gravely concerned about the actual term Fake News. Ain't life fun.

But, point out to me where the previous president (or any of his spokespeople/surrogates) called the press 'the enemy of the American people'.  I'll wait.

[heironymouspasparagus]

This is what the alt-right, Breitbart world view is - from their lead spokesperson. This is why they are defending and rationalizing and excusing Trump's pedophilia with the 15 and 16 year old girls at the Miss Teen USA pageants he used to own and run.   It is very clear, open, and even bragged about both from this guy and Trump when he talked about walking into the dressing rooms so he could make sure everything was ok.   

There is no ambiguity.  There is only the question of whether one condones and excuses that action or not.  And 40%+ of this country do - everyone who voted for Trump.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/milo-yiannopoulos-slammed-defending-pedophilia-113103431.html