Riverwalk Crossing Phase II and King's Landing.

[aoxamaxoa]

Do you think Tulsa should bail them out like we did the aquarium?

[perspicuity85]

According to a Jenks Chamber of Commerce website's news release dated 11/28/05, the city received a 20.9% increase in sales tax revenue from November 2004.  According to the website, Riverwalk Crossing contributed greatly to the sales tax revenue.  The Tulsa World recently reported more tax revenue increases for Jenks in November 2006.     It seems obvious to me that Riverwalk Crossing has greatly benefited the city of Jenks economically.  It also seems apparent that Mr. Gordon realized this benefit, and tried to snake his way into some TIF financing for the Riverwalk.  Jenks refused him because TIF is supposed to be used to encourage development in areas that are either economically depressed or under-developed.  I agree with Jenks- granting TIF to the Riverwalk would not be an appropriate use of TIF because the Riverwalk is a well established development (especially for Jenks).  Mr. Gordon needs to just bite the bullet and invest his own company's money (which there likely is plenty of) and finish his development.  I find Gordon's whoring around between Tulsa and Jenks for TIF dollars to be quite comical.

[TheArtist]

I didnt know the aquarium was privately owned?  Are there any large aquariums that aren't partly or mostly funded by taxpayer dollars?

Plus why would he need to be bailed out?  I thought the article said he was closing on a deal with a bank to start phase 2 and was also looking into a TIF from Jenks to help with infrastructure needs.   I dont live in Jenks so it wouldnt be a "we" "bailing them out" if thats what your calling the TIF, anyway lol. Do you?

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by aoxamaxoa

Do you think Tulsa should bail them out like we did the aquarium?

Wow.

Just wow.

Tulsa never bailed out the aquarium.

The aquarium has been "overperforming" since it opened.

Vision2025 paid some money to accelerate debt payoff. Kinda like paying off your 5 year car note in 4.5 years. Glad credit companies don't think like you, then everyone who overpays is "going bankrupt."

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by perspicuity85

According to a Jenks Chamber of Commerce website's news release dated 11/28/05, the city received a 20.9% increase in sales tax revenue from November 2004.  According to the website, Riverwalk Crossing contributed greatly to the sales tax revenue.  The Tulsa World recently reported more tax revenue increases for Jenks in November 2006.     It seems obvious to me that Riverwalk Crossing has greatly benefited the city of Jenks economically.  It also seems apparent that Mr. Gordon realized this benefit, and tried to snake his way into some TIF financing for the Riverwalk.  Jenks refused him because TIF is supposed to be used to encourage development in areas that are either economically depressed or under-developed.  I agree with Jenks- granting TIF to the Riverwalk would not be an appropriate use of TIF because the Riverwalk is a well established development (especially for Jenks).  Mr. Gordon needs to just bite the bullet and invest his own company's money (which there likely is plenty of) and finish his development.  I find Gordon's whoring around between Tulsa and Jenks for TIF dollars to be quite comical.

Gordon isn't sitting on a pile of cash. He used it for phase 1.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by aoxamaxoa

Oh, the big retailers must be wrong. I am sorry for being sooooo judgemental. BTW, if you have not seen anybody here complain about the parking there, you must not be reading the same threads I do....

Yes, parking has been mentioned a lot, especially since the theater opened. There is a lot of "yet to be paved" parking.

[aoxamaxoa]

The 2025 initiative bailed out the Jenks aquarium. If we had not, it would never had seen success. Yes, we subsidized the finished product. It was a BAIT and switch development. I think there are 2 or 3 successful type aquarium museums across the country. The rest drown in debt.

You posties seem to bat around alot.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by aoxamaxoa

The 2025 initiative bailed out the Jenks aquarium. If we had not, it would never had seen success. Yes, we subsidized the finished product. It was a BAIT and switch development. I think there are 2 or 3 successful type aquarium museums across the country. The rest drown in debt.

You posties seem to bat around alot.

If you do a little resaerch, the aquarium had membership and ticket sales something like 20% above projections. Most other aquariums are failing, but the one in Jenks was built largely with donations and has much of it's operating costs the same way. By and large, it looks very good on paper.

[RecycleMichael]

I always thought that the fishing tackle collection at the aquarium was a little weird.

Kind of like having a gun show at the zoo.

[TheArtist]

quote:Originally posted by recyclemichael

I always thought that the fishing tackle collection at the aquarium was a little weird.

Kind of like having a gun show at the zoo.

They should have put that near the entrance to a good Seafood Restaurant.[]

[TheArtist]

quote:Originally posted by aoxamaxoa

The 2025 initiative bailed out the Jenks aquarium. If we had not, it would never had seen success. Yes, we subsidized the finished product. It was a BAIT and switch development. I think there are 2 or 3 successful type aquarium museums across the country. The rest drown in debt.

You posties seem to bat around alot.

I don't consider a nonprofit aquarium as anything like the for profit business venture of the riverwalk.  I dont even see how or why you make a comparison?  If your going to gripe about "bailing out" the aquarium with 2025 money, how about the bait and switch and bail out of the Planetarium and Air and Space Museum? Or how about Mohawk Park? The other parks, the trails and river?  Why bail them out? Goodness a swimming pool and community center in Skiatook? You mean to tell me swimming pools cant be funded privately and run at a profit?  The Oklahoma Jazz Hall of Fame?  We gonna start bailing out every type of music venue in town?

To me the aquarium is more of a combination... educational tool, recreational facility, area attraction, cultural and entertainment asset, than it is a for profit business venture like the Riverwalk.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by TheArtist

quote:Originally posted by recyclemichael

I always thought that the fishing tackle collection at the aquarium was a little weird.

Kind of like having a gun show at the zoo.

They should have put that near the entrance to a good Seafood Restaurant.[]

The aquarium did feature recipes next to the shrimp and fish exhibits.

Plus they are building a new seafood restaurant.

The whole reason for "The Karl and Beverly White National Bait & Tackle Museum" is that Karl White is local and looking for a place to donate. Plus, many of the exhibits are from companies either located in, or tied to, oklahoma. The museum is currently only large enough to house about a third of his collection.

I'm not a fan, just wanted to clear that up.

[RecycleMichael]

What kind of seafood will they serve?

Here is your fish sandwich...sorry it is ugly. We keep the pretty ones for the fish tanks...

[pmcalk]

quote:Originally posted by aoxamaxoa

Oh, the big retailers must be wrong. I am sorry for being sooooo judgemental. BTW, if you have not seen anybody here complain about the parking there, you must not be reading the same threads I do....

Great response!  You avoid actually answering the question, while at the same time appearing smug, all-knowing, and as though you actually know some big-time retailers.  Are you a politician?

In case you forgot, the question is how can one side of the river be a good location, and the other be bad?

[BKDotCom]

This thread smells especially troll-like.