Birth Control Is Harmful?

[sgrizzle]

So Nellie, I'm not arguing, just want an opinion on something.

You have a young couple. The man either doesn't want kids or wants to wait until later (married, buy a house, better job or something.) The woman does want kids so she stops taking birth control without telling her SO.

Other than the obvious "lying is bad" part, how does this reflect on male and female roles in birth control choices? Is it within her rights for the woman to do this? If the man fathers a child under false pretenses, is he still just as legally liable? If he is legally liable, could the aforementioned lying be considered some sort of breach of contract?

Just throwing something out there for discussion.

[NellieBly]

If he's so worried about his lying girlfriend getting pregnant then that sounds like a communication problem -- or he could be responsible for his own birth control. OH WAIT that's right -- the best medical scientists in the world still can't come up with effective oral birth control for men. Though, I know very few women who would trust a man who told her 'it's okay baby -- I'm on the pill."

Why is Viagra covered by insurance and birth control isn't???

[NellieBly]

And don't forget -- the pill isn't 100 percent effective and if you are on certain medications, it isn't effective at all. Women get pregnant accidentally all the time while using birth control responsibly.

We are all responsible for our OWN reproductive rights...You know...personal responsibility.

Don't play the game (sex) if you don't want to be a parent. That's what abstinence is about. Being responsible. The same as being responsible about taking birth control if you choose to have sex and don't want to be a parent.

[MichaelC]

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

Why is Viagra covered by insurance and birth control isn't???

I think there might be a Catholic Priest joke in there.

Somewhere.

[rwarn17588]

<Nellie wrote:

Why is Viagra covered by insurance and birth control isn't???

<end clip>

Depends on your insurer. Some do cover the pill. But some insurers won't cover Viagra, either. There's no set pattern, really.

When I was younger, my insurer didn't cover the cost of my condoms, either.

[sgrizzle]

Every insurance I've had covers it.

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

Men have no place in women's reproductive rights.

Then you absolve men of all responsibility for birth control?

quote:
Becoming and being a father or parent is one thing -- telling me how and when I can buy or use birth control or get an abortion is nunya.

I don't remember ever telling you that.

[NellieBly]

Yes I absolve all men of being responsible for birth control. I don't know a single woman who depends on a man for birth control -- unless of course we're talking vasectomy.

I was using the 'you' as a general term for men.

Do a little checking -- very few insurance policies pay for birth control. If they do pay for it, it is still expensive. Pharmacists, maybe it's both men and women, are also choosing not to fill prescriptions for birth control because it's against their religion or whatever.

[si_uk_lon_ok]

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

Yes I absolve all men of being responsible for birth control. I don't know a single woman who depends on a man for birth control -- unless of course we're talking vasectomy.

I was using the 'you' as a general term for men.

I would point out that male birth control methods namely the condom do have other uses such as stopping VD. So I think men have to be responsible for birth control if only to protect themselves and thier partner from disease.

[swake]

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

Yes I absolve all men of being responsible for birth control. I don't know a single woman who depends on a man for birth control -- unless of course we're talking vasectomy.

I was using the 'you' as a general term for men.

Do a little checking -- very few insurance policies pay for birth control. If they do pay for it, it is still expensive. Pharmacists, maybe it's both men and women, are also choosing not to fill prescriptions for birth control because it's against their religion or whatever.

Every plan I have ever had over the years, and my and my wife's employers love to change regularly, have covered "the pill", all of them. And none were expensive, it's always been in the very cheapest class of drug in the plan.

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

Yes I absolve all men of being responsible for birth control.

Then, if a woman fails to use an effective enough birth control, the man shouldn't have to bear any responsibility for the child? I kinda doubt if you'd stick to your position in that case.

quote:I don't know a single woman who depends on a man for birth control -- unless of course we're talking vasectomy.

Sounds to me like you've got a little bit of an attitude toward men. Seems to me like it's a SHARED responsibility.

quote:
I was using the 'you' as a general term for men.

Yes, I've noticed that you do generalize men. If a man does that, he's called a sexist. What do you call a woman who does it?

quote:
Do a little checking -- very few insurance policies pay for birth control. If they do pay for it, it is still expensive. Pharmacists, maybe it's both men and women, are also choosing not to fill prescriptions for birth control because it's against their religion or whatever.

Okay, I did a little checking. Some pay for Viagra and not birth control. Some pay for birth control and not Viagra. Some pay for both. So what's your point?

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

Every insurance I've had covers it.

Same here. And the copay for BCPs was the same as the copay for anything else.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

If he's so worried about his lying girlfriend getting pregnant then that sounds like a communication problem -- or he could be responsible for his own birth control. OH WAIT that's right -- the best medical scientists in the world still can't come up with effective oral birth control for men. Though, I know very few women who would trust a man who told her 'it's okay baby -- I'm on the pill."

Why is Viagra covered by insurance and birth control isn't???

So out of all your explanations, you leave the woman blameless?

[pmcalk]

I don't think she was saying the woman was admirable.  Just that whenever two people (of the opposite sex) engage in sex, there is always a risk of pregnancy.  Every guy should accept that he could become financially responsible for a child if he has sex.

The financial responsibility of raising a child is different from the right of a person to control their body.  There are many things in a relationship that are shared, at least in healthy relationships.  And most women will listen to their significant other when making life altering decisions like having kids.  But ultimately, if a woman does not want to be pregnant, no one should be able to force her.

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by pmcalk

I don't think she was saying the woman was admirable.  Just that whenever two people (of the opposite sex) engage in sex, there is always a risk of pregnancy.  Every guy should accept that he could become financially responsible for a child if he has sex.

Unless I misunderstood, she said she completely absolves men of all responsibility because birth control is none of our business.

quote:
The financial responsibility of raising a child is different from the right of a person to control their body.  There are many things in a relationship that are shared, at least in healthy relationships.  And most women will listen to their significant other when making life altering decisions like having kids.  But ultimately, if a woman does not want to be pregnant, no one should be able to force her.

I absolutely agree with everything you said here. But saying that men shouldn't have (or at least shouldn't express) an opinion on birth control is as asinine as saying that anyone who hasn't served in the military shouldn't express an opinion on the war. A lot of this is essentially moot to me because A. I'm married and strictly monogamous and B. I've been neutered. And while, strictly speaking it was my final decision to get a vasectomy, you'd better believe that my wife AND I discussed and I would NOT have done it if she had opposed it.