Maple Ridge shoots self in foot

[inteller]

quote:Originally posted by recyclemichael

I guess I didn't think the green boxes were too ugly. Yes, they would be weird to have in the front yard, but couldn't you landscape around it...hide it with a bush?

what is this 'bush' thing you speak of?  I'm just an unfrozen caveman lawyer with a house in MR.  These concepts confuse me...to think that you could 'hide' something that is already green and matches the color of my yard.

[Steve]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by Steve

quote:Originally posted by pfox

Here is my question...what was to happen to the phone and cable lines?  Weren't they going to remain on poles?

Yes.  I have changed my mind about the "green boxes" for my neighborhood (26th & Yale area.)  At first I wanted none of it, but now I don't think it would be that bad.  But the poles, cable and phone lines would remain.  Why go to all the trouble and expense, which we utility customers will all pay for in the long run, if they don't bury all the lines at the same time eliminate the poles entirely?  Until they do this, I will oppose burying the PSO lines in my neighborhood.

When you get walmart, target and food pyramid to all sell milk for 50c a gallon, then pursue this.

Since the city isn't paying the utilities to bury, what motivation do the other utilities have to follow suit?

No the city isn't paying for it, we the captive electric company customers are.

I suppose it is sheer folly on my part to think that PSO, Cox, SWB/AT&T and all the companies that use the power poles for transmission lines could come together, synergize their efforts, and eliminate the poles and unsightly above ground wires altogether.  If they could muster the guts and cooperation to do that, I would fully support the line burial in my neighborhood.  Until then, I do not.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by Steve


I suppose it is sheer folly on my part to think that PSO, Cox, SWB/AT&T and all the companies that use the power poles for transmission lines could come together, synergize their efforts, and eliminate the poles and unsightly above ground wires altogether.  If they could muster the guts and cooperation to do that, I would fully support the line burial in my neighborhood.  Until then, I do not.

When that happensm akk of the auto manufacturers will switch to hybrids only, SUV production will halt, McDonalds will feel guilty and shut down and so will all the cigarette companies.

This all seems very "Miss America."

Everyone complains about reliability, environmentalism, aesthetics and rates. Most power companies can do 2 pretty well, 3 pretty well, and with 4 you're breaking the laws of physics.

[Steve]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by Steve


I suppose it is sheer folly on my part to think that PSO, Cox, SWB/AT&T and all the companies that use the power poles for transmission lines could come together, synergize their efforts, and eliminate the poles and unsightly above ground wires altogether.  If they could muster the guts and cooperation to do that, I would fully support the line burial in my neighborhood.  Until then, I do not.

When that happensm akk of the auto manufacturers will switch to hybrids only, SUV production will halt, McDonalds will feel guilty and shut down and so will all the cigarette companies.

This all seems very "Miss America."

Everyone complains about reliability, environmentalism, aesthetics and rates. Most power companies can do 2 pretty well, 3 pretty well, and with 4 you're breaking the laws of physics.

Well I am sorry sqrizzle, if my opinions are too "Miss America" for you.  I just thought that if PSO was going to go through the expense of burying the lines, that the other TV and communication utilities might save some money and bury their lines at the same time, eliminate the poles altogether, beautify our Tulsa neighborhoods, and save us rate payers some money in the process.  Silly me.  Lets just do it one company at a time so all the utilities can tack on fees and up the rates as they each bury the lines, when they could have done it all at one time much cheaper.

I don't give a damn about 2, 3, or 4 utility companies involved.  I am just talking about common sense and combining efforts.  If PSO comes in my neighborhood to bury lines without the cable and phones lines also to be buried, then I will loudly oppose this.  It is just plain common sense, something most utilities and you have forgotten.

[waterboy]

Hey, Steve, they can't work together, legally. When I asked my AT&T lineman to move the line over my backyard next to the cable line, he practically read the law to me. They can't even be within two feet of each other. Very competitive situation.

I don't see huge utilities working together for the sake of their customers, as odd as that sounds. Their first priority is to provide reliable service to us...at a profit. Then what we would like to have cosmetically is farther down the list. There was a time when PSO wouldn't even ask about putting green boxes in my front yard. Those days are over.

[YoungTulsan]

They use the law as an excuse.  They are competative because they are increasingly offering the same services.  Cable used to just be TV.  But they started offering phone service, since digitally, it can be pulled off.  The phone company used to just offer telephone service.  And then digital internet (DSL) which was competative with cable.  Now they try to enter the video market since video is digitally transferred over those net connects.  Cable vs. Phone is at a cutthroat competative level right now.  They would both rather make the consumer suffer than cooperate with one another.

Waterboy, I'm pretty sure your AT&T guy was just doing what he was told to demonize the evil cable company that didn't want to cooperate on a simple common-sense project of utility consolidation.

This whole thing about the companies not cooperating helps me to understand Maple Ridge opposing the deal though.  Gaining a big box in your yard, but still having utilities on poles at the same time?  What is the benefit in that?  I'm just as pissed when my internet, phone, or TV die as I am when the power goes out.  At least when you have above ground electric, the tree trimming crews will come out to ensure there isn't interference with branches on those lines.  Do Cox or AT&T do anything of that sort?

[Wilbur]

quote: This whole thing about the companies not cooperating helps me to understand Maple Ridge opposing the deal though. Gaining a big box in your yard, but still having utilities on poles at the same time? What is the benefit in that? I'm just as pissed when my internet, phone, or TV die as I am when the power goes out. At least when you have above ground electric, the tree trimming crews will come out to ensure there isn't interference with branches on those lines. Do Cox or AT&T do anything of that sort?

PSO can't win, no matter what they do.  They get complained on when the power goes out.  They get yelled at for trimming the trees.  Now they get yelled at for trying to bury the lines.  

I would assume moving everyone's electricity to the backyards is a problem of rights-of-way.  They probably have utility easements in the front yards, but not the back.  I can't even imagine the legal problems of taking on even more easements in people's back yards.  People built things in their backyards knowing there was no easement.  What happens when a utility tries to come in a change an easement and starts tearing up pools, sheds, ......?

Mapleridge doesn't want their power lines buried in the front easements, fine.  Then put up with the power outages and shut up!

[pmcalk]

quote:Originally posted by Wilbur

quote: This whole thing about the companies not cooperating helps me to understand Maple Ridge opposing the deal though. Gaining a big box in your yard, but still having utilities on poles at the same time? What is the benefit in that? I'm just as pissed when my internet, phone, or TV die as I am when the power goes out. At least when you have above ground electric, the tree trimming crews will come out to ensure there isn't interference with branches on those lines. Do Cox or AT&T do anything of that sort?

PSO can't win, no matter what they do.  They get complained on when the power goes out.  They get yelled at for trimming the trees.  Now they get yelled at for trying to bury the lines.  

I would assume moving everyone's electricity to the backyards is a problem of rights-of-way.  They probably have utility easements in the front yards, but not the back.  I can't even imagine the legal problems of taking on even more easements in people's back yards.  People built things in their backyards knowing there was no easement.  What happens when a utility tries to come in a change an easement and starts tearing up pools, sheds, ......?

Mapleridge doesn't want their power lines buried in the front easements, fine.  Then put up with the power outages and shut up!

No, the easements are in the backyard.  There is an easement with the city already existing in the front yard (streets & water), which allows them to put the wires there.

[patric]

quote:Originally posted by Steve  I don't give a damn about 2, 3, or 4 utility companies involved.  I am just talking about common sense and combining efforts.  If PSO comes in my neighborhood to bury lines without the cable and phones lines also to be buried, then I will loudly oppose this.  It is just plain common sense, something most utilities and you have forgotten.

The way it's supposed to work is once the power is undergrounded, co-located utilities sharing the pole (cable, phone) also migrate to buried service when the electric utility stops supporting the poles.  How long the migration takes is another matter, but the city could have some say in the form of their franchise agreement with the utility.

An ordinance mandating undergrounding for all new construction would be a fine addition to the new Comprehensive Plan, as well as a timetable for conversion of the rest of the city (especially the areas where knocking down one pole affects 14,000 customers, ahem.)

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by patric


The way it's supposed to work is once the power is undergrounded, co-located utilities sharing the pole (cable, phone) also migrate to buried service when the electric utility stops supporting the poles.  How long the migration takes is another matter, but the city could have some say in the form of their franchise agreement with the utility.

An ordinance mandating undergrounding for all new construction would be a fine addition to the new Comprehensive Plan, as well as a timetable for conversion of the rest of the city (especially the areas where knocking down one pole affects 14,000 customers, ahem.)

The line that was taken out was a high-voltage transmission line, which would probably be at the very end of the underground priority list, if ever. The vehicle that took out the line (driven by a distant relative of mine) was hit and knocked into the pole at pretty high speed.

[RecycleMichael]

I am glad you know who this is.

I might file a lawsuit for the loss of a freezer full of frozen pizzas and ice cream sandwiches.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by recyclemichael

I am glad you know who this is.

I might file a lawsuit for the loss of a freezer full of frozen pizzas and ice cream sandwiches.

I don't know who caused the accident, but the woman who got knocked into the pole is at St Francis with her back broken.

[RecycleMichael]

My neighborhood didn't lose power. I was just looking at a way to get some more junk food in the freezer.

Sorry to hear about your relative. Hope they get OK.

[YoungTulsan]

quote:Originally posted by recyclemichael

I am glad you know who this is.

I might file a lawsuit for the loss of a freezer full of frozen pizzas and ice cream sandwiches.

You mean your freezer full of lobster, filet mignon, dodo egg, your home-made cure for AIDS, and Albert Einstein's brain.

[Rose]

I'm glad AEP is skipping Mapleridge, AKA "the neighborhood of complainers".  

Hopefully AEP will make it over to my neighborhood soon.  I'd rather have the box than the overhead lines.  If they'll let me, I'm going to paint it to look like dice or a Happy Meal box.

Mapleridge needs to stop stopping everything so midtown can progress.