Think the police will change?

[patric]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010


The complete story was that officers needed the original unedited footage for evidence. The footage was later subpoenaed from the stations that did not make it available. This footage was needed because just like you have previously shown, if the "orginal" unedited footage was not available defense attorneys and police conspiracy wingnuts would say the footage was altered or that it "casts more suspicion on their credibility".

Police departments routinely subpoena video they need from broadcasters, and the media routinely complies.  Threatening reporters with arrest at the scene is NOT how honest cops perform an investigative function.

...and that's also an interesting double-standard you're applying to availability of "original" footage...

quote:Some guy came out and videotaped a car stop I had on E. pine street. I didn't care that he did it and allowed it to continue.  However, if something would have happened (person arrested for a criminal offense, possession of CDS, firearm, Kidnapping if he had someone tied up in the car, he resisted arrest ect.) then that video would have been evidence of the event and I would probably have seized it.

Again, a subpoena of the tape would have been a better option than an illegal search and seizure fueling speculation of evidence tampering.


[/quote]The edited videos the OHP submitted didnt prove anything, and their refusal to make the original unedited video public casts more suspicion on their credibility.

-Sorry, I should say it proved it to everyone but the black helicopter people.  I wonder if the black helicopter people still watch reruns of the X-files because they think it brings "the truth" to light? [/quote]


In your mind, do you consider anyone questioning abuses of authority "black helicopter people"?

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010


The complete story was that officers needed the original unedited footage for evidence. The footage was later subpoenaed from the stations that did not make it available. This footage was needed because just like you have previously shown, if the "orginal" unedited footage was not available defense attorneys and police conspiracy wingnuts would say the footage was altered or that it "casts more suspicion on their credibility".

Police departments routinely subpoena video they need from broadcasters, and the media routinely complies.  Threatening reporters with arrest at the scene is NOT how honest cops perform an investigative function.

...and that's also an interesting double-standard you're applying to availability of "original" footage...

quote:Some guy came out and videotaped a car stop I had on E. pine street. I didn't care that he did it and allowed it to continue.  However, if something would have happened (person arrested for a criminal offense, possession of CDS, firearm, Kidnapping if he had someone tied up in the car, he resisted arrest ect.) then that video would have been evidence of the event and I would probably have seized it.

Again, a subpoena of the tape would have been a better option than an illegal search and seizure fueling speculation of evidence tampering.

The edited videos the OHP submitted didnt prove anything, and their refusal to make the original unedited video public casts more suspicion on their credibility.

-Sorry, I should say it proved it to everyone but the black helicopter people.  I wonder if the black helicopter people still watch reruns of the X-files because they think it brings "the truth" to light? [/quote]


In your mind, do you consider anyone questioning abuses of authority "black helicopter people"?
[/quote]

Please list the names of the news media that were "threatened" instead of making vague allegations. If you think "they" do not wish their names to be known, tell them "they" can file anonymous complaints at....

http://www.tulsapolice.org/oic.html

or they can go to 600 Civic Center Suite 302 and make the complaint in person Monday - Friday 8:00am to 5:00pm.  If "they" wish to talk to someone on the phone they can call 918-596-9379 or if they wish to write a letter directly to Chief Palmer, 600 Civic Center Tulsa, OK 74103.

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

- There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

What do you mean double standard?  Please explain your position.

People can investigate abuses of authority all they want. Most people encourage it but if there is evidence that the abuse did not occur then it should accepted.  I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

[patric]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

Did you already forget the part where they phoned their supervisors?

quote: There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

Why follow the law when you can bully your way?   Reporters dont work at the pleasure of police, and they were right to stand their ground and not surrender the only copies of their footage in an illegal seizure.  It's just a shame the average citizen doesnt have a legal department on-call to quickly intervene during abuses.

quote:I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

Muskogee defense attorney Lance McCrary is the one complaining about the edited dashcam video.  The Tulsa World also reported they were not allowed to examine the recording in detail.  Black Helicopter People?

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

Did you already forget the part where they phoned their supervisors?

quote: There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

Why follow the law when you can bully your way?   Reporters dont work at the pleasure of police, and they were right to stand their ground and not surrender the only copies of their footage in an illegal seizure.  It's just a shame the average citizen doesnt have a legal department on-call to quickly intervene during abuses.

quote:I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

Muskogee defense attorney Lance McCrary is the one complaining about the edited dashcam video.  The Tulsa World also reported they were not allowed to examine the recording in detail.  Black Helicopter People?

As of this date, no complaint has been received from any media outlets regarding the seizure of any tapes of the incident.  No media outlet was "bullied" into giving the tapes up. There was no illegal seizure. Is that clear enough for you?

The average person can know their rights.

Lance McCrary is attempting to get his client out of trouble. His first defense for his client was "The trooper is lying." After the tape was released, his second defense for his client was "the tape has been altered!". That was the only defense for his client left to him.

The Tulsa world received copies of the original. They wanted THE orginal or at least access to the orginal.  That is simply not going to happen when there is litigation pending.

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

Did you already forget the part where they phoned their supervisors?

quote: There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

Why follow the law when you can bully your way?   Reporters dont work at the pleasure of police, and they were right to stand their ground and not surrender the only copies of their footage in an illegal seizure.  It's just a shame the average citizen doesnt have a legal department on-call to quickly intervene during abuses.

quote:I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

Muskogee defense attorney Lance McCrary is the one complaining about the edited dashcam video.  The Tulsa World also reported they were not allowed to examine the recording in detail.  Black Helicopter People?

As of this date, no complaint has been received from any media outlets regarding the seizure of any tapes of the incident.  No media outlet was "bullied" into giving the tapes up. There was no illegal seizure. Is that clear enough for you?

The average person can know their rights.

Lance McCrary is attempting to get his client out of trouble. His first defense for his client was "The trooper is lying." After the tape was released, his second defense for his client was "the tape has been altered!". That was the only defense for his client left to him.

The Tulsa world received copies of the original. They wanted THE orginal or at least access to the orginal.  That is simply not going to happen when there is litigation pending.

Oh Pardon, Monsieur.

When the Tulsa police shoot someone to death, no INDEPENDENT investigation is ever conducted.

Rather, the Police investigate THEMSELVES.

How can the police be INDEPENDENT to investigate themselves?

Answer:

They CANNOT.

When the police investigate a police shooting death, the facile D.A. is already inking up the
"JUSTIFIABLE HOMICIDE" rubber stamp.

Period.

All of what seems to the citizen as murderous madness actually has a rationale basis:

Namely, to make you AFRAID.

Be Afraid.  Be very Afraid.  This could happen to you.  

Obey, or ELSE.

Welcome to the New World Order, Kameraden.

[}:)]

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

Did you already forget the part where they phoned their supervisors?

quote: There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

Why follow the law when you can bully your way?   Reporters dont work at the pleasure of police, and they were right to stand their ground and not surrender the only copies of their footage in an illegal seizure.  It's just a shame the average citizen doesnt have a legal department on-call to quickly intervene during abuses.

quote:I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

Muskogee defense attorney Lance McCrary is the one complaining about the edited dashcam video.  The Tulsa World also reported they were not allowed to examine the recording in detail.  Black Helicopter People?

As of this date, no complaint has been received from any media outlets regarding the seizure of any tapes of the incident.  No media outlet was "bullied" into giving the tapes up. There was no illegal seizure. Is that clear enough for you?

The average person can know their rights.

Lance McCrary is attempting to get his client out of trouble. His first defense for his client was "The trooper is lying." After the tape was released, his second defense for his client was "the tape has been altered!". That was the only defense for his client left to him.

The Tulsa world received copies of the original. They wanted THE orginal or at least access to the orginal.  That is simply not going to happen when there is litigation pending.

Oh Pardon, Monsieur.

When the Tulsa police shoot someone to death, no INDEPENDENT investigation is ever conducted.

Rather, the Police investigate THEMSELVES.

How can the police be INDEPENDENT to investigate themselves?

Answer:

They CANNOT.

When the police investigate a police shooting death, the facile D.A. is already inking up the
"JUSTIFIABLE HOMICIDE" rubber stamp.

Period.

All of what seems to the citizen as murderous madness actually has a rationale basis:

Namely, to make you AFRAID.

Be Afraid.  Be very Afraid.  This could happen to you.  

Obey, or ELSE.

Welcome to the New World Order, Kameraden.

[}:)]

Who would you like to do the investigation?

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

Did you already forget the part where they phoned their supervisors?

quote: There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

Why follow the law when you can bully your way?   Reporters dont work at the pleasure of police, and they were right to stand their ground and not surrender the only copies of their footage in an illegal seizure.  It's just a shame the average citizen doesnt have a legal department on-call to quickly intervene during abuses.

quote:I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

Muskogee defense attorney Lance McCrary is the one complaining about the edited dashcam video.  The Tulsa World also reported they were not allowed to examine the recording in detail.  Black Helicopter People?

As of this date, no complaint has been received from any media outlets regarding the seizure of any tapes of the incident.  No media outlet was "bullied" into giving the tapes up. There was no illegal seizure. Is that clear enough for you?

The average person can know their rights.

Lance McCrary is attempting to get his client out of trouble. His first defense for his client was "The trooper is lying." After the tape was released, his second defense for his client was "the tape has been altered!". That was the only defense for his client left to him.

The Tulsa world received copies of the original. They wanted THE orginal or at least access to the orginal.  That is simply not going to happen when there is litigation pending.

Oh Pardon, Monsieur.

When the Tulsa police shoot someone to death, no INDEPENDENT investigation is ever conducted.

Rather, the Police investigate THEMSELVES.

How can the police be INDEPENDENT to investigate themselves?

Answer:

They CANNOT.

When the police investigate a police shooting death, the facile D.A. is already inking up the
"JUSTIFIABLE HOMICIDE" rubber stamp.

Period.

All of what seems to the citizen as murderous madness actually has a rationale basis:

Namely, to make you AFRAID.

Be Afraid.  Be very Afraid.  This could happen to you.  

Obey, or ELSE.

Welcome to the New World Order, Kameraden.

[}:)]

Who would you like to do the investigation?

Greg Bledsoe.

or,

Clark Brewster

or,

Louis Bullock.

How's Zat?

THREE (3) independent investigators.

I'll volunteer as a fourth.

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

Did you already forget the part where they phoned their supervisors?

quote: There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

Why follow the law when you can bully your way?   Reporters dont work at the pleasure of police, and they were right to stand their ground and not surrender the only copies of their footage in an illegal seizure.  It's just a shame the average citizen doesnt have a legal department on-call to quickly intervene during abuses.

quote:I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

Muskogee defense attorney Lance McCrary is the one complaining about the edited dashcam video.  The Tulsa World also reported they were not allowed to examine the recording in detail.  Black Helicopter People?

As of this date, no complaint has been received from any media outlets regarding the seizure of any tapes of the incident.  No media outlet was "bullied" into giving the tapes up. There was no illegal seizure. Is that clear enough for you?

The average person can know their rights.

Lance McCrary is attempting to get his client out of trouble. His first defense for his client was "The trooper is lying." After the tape was released, his second defense for his client was "the tape has been altered!". That was the only defense for his client left to him.

The Tulsa world received copies of the original. They wanted THE orginal or at least access to the orginal.  That is simply not going to happen when there is litigation pending.

Oh Pardon, Monsieur.

When the Tulsa police shoot someone to death, no INDEPENDENT investigation is ever conducted.

Rather, the Police investigate THEMSELVES.

How can the police be INDEPENDENT to investigate themselves?

Answer:

They CANNOT.

When the police investigate a police shooting death, the facile D.A. is already inking up the
"JUSTIFIABLE HOMICIDE" rubber stamp.

Period.

All of what seems to the citizen as murderous madness actually has a rationale basis:

Namely, to make you AFRAID.

Be Afraid.  Be very Afraid.  This could happen to you.  

Obey, or ELSE.

Welcome to the New World Order, Kameraden.

[}:)]

Who would you like to do the investigation?

Greg Bledsoe.

or,

Clark Brewster

or,

Louis Bullock.

How's Zat?

THREE (3) independent investigators.

I'll volunteer as a fourth.

So I see the Bear isn't here he is  just a pigment of my imagination...?

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

Did you already forget the part where they phoned their supervisors?

quote: There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

Why follow the law when you can bully your way?   Reporters dont work at the pleasure of police, and they were right to stand their ground and not surrender the only copies of their footage in an illegal seizure.  It's just a shame the average citizen doesnt have a legal department on-call to quickly intervene during abuses.

quote:I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

Muskogee defense attorney Lance McCrary is the one complaining about the edited dashcam video.  The Tulsa World also reported they were not allowed to examine the recording in detail.  Black Helicopter People?

As of this date, no complaint has been received from any media outlets regarding the seizure of any tapes of the incident.  No media outlet was "bullied" into giving the tapes up. There was no illegal seizure. Is that clear enough for you?

The average person can know their rights.

Lance McCrary is attempting to get his client out of trouble. His first defense for his client was "The trooper is lying." After the tape was released, his second defense for his client was "the tape has been altered!". That was the only defense for his client left to him.

The Tulsa world received copies of the original. They wanted THE orginal or at least access to the orginal.  That is simply not going to happen when there is litigation pending.

Oh Pardon, Monsieur.

When the Tulsa police shoot someone to death, no INDEPENDENT investigation is ever conducted.

Rather, the Police investigate THEMSELVES.

How can the police be INDEPENDENT to investigate themselves?

Answer:

They CANNOT.

When the police investigate a police shooting death, the facile D.A. is already inking up the
"JUSTIFIABLE HOMICIDE" rubber stamp.

Period.

All of what seems to the citizen as murderous madness actually has a rationale basis:

Namely, to make you AFRAID.

Be Afraid.  Be very Afraid.  This could happen to you.  

Obey, or ELSE.

Welcome to the New World Order, Kameraden.

[}:)]

Who would you like to do the investigation?

Greg Bledsoe.

or,

Clark Brewster

or,

Louis Bullock.

How's Zat?

THREE (3) independent investigators.

I'll volunteer as a fourth.

I love Clark Brewster.  He represented Rico Yarbrough. He tried everything to get him accuited. He almost got thrown in jail for contempt of court on two occassions during the trial.  In the end,  he just couldn't overcome the recorded phone conversations. When he gets really mad in court, he moves his head back and forth and he looks kind of like a rooster.

Louis Bullock isn't as good as Brewster. He really just goes after the deep pockets. I don't think the city could afford him to investigate anything.

I haven't had any dealings with Greg Bledsoe.

These were all funny picks but I am still curious who you think would be "independent" and could do an thorough investigation?

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I have a feeling no news media individuals will make a complaint because it simply did not happen like you said.

Did you already forget the part where they phoned their supervisors?

quote: There is no reason to get a subpoena for something that people are willing to just give to you.

Why follow the law when you can bully your way?   Reporters dont work at the pleasure of police, and they were right to stand their ground and not surrender the only copies of their footage in an illegal seizure.  It's just a shame the average citizen doesnt have a legal department on-call to quickly intervene during abuses.

quote:I make fun of the black helicopter people because they are the ones that always scream, "The tapes were altered or everyone is in on the fix!"

Muskogee defense attorney Lance McCrary is the one complaining about the edited dashcam video.  The Tulsa World also reported they were not allowed to examine the recording in detail.  Black Helicopter People?

As of this date, no complaint has been received from any media outlets regarding the seizure of any tapes of the incident.  No media outlet was "bullied" into giving the tapes up. There was no illegal seizure. Is that clear enough for you?

The average person can know their rights.

Lance McCrary is attempting to get his client out of trouble. His first defense for his client was "The trooper is lying." After the tape was released, his second defense for his client was "the tape has been altered!". That was the only defense for his client left to him.

The Tulsa world received copies of the original. They wanted THE orginal or at least access to the orginal.  That is simply not going to happen when there is litigation pending.

Oh Pardon, Monsieur.

When the Tulsa police shoot someone to death, no INDEPENDENT investigation is ever conducted.

Rather, the Police investigate THEMSELVES.

How can the police be INDEPENDENT to investigate themselves?

Answer:

They CANNOT.

When the police investigate a police shooting death, the facile D.A. is already inking up the
"JUSTIFIABLE HOMICIDE" rubber stamp.

Period.

All of what seems to the citizen as murderous madness actually has a rationale basis:

Namely, to make you AFRAID.

Be Afraid.  Be very Afraid.  This could happen to you.  

Obey, or ELSE.

Welcome to the New World Order, Kameraden.

[}:)]

Who would you like to do the investigation?

Greg Bledsoe.

or,

Clark Brewster

or,

Louis Bullock.

How's Zat?

THREE (3) independent investigators.

I'll volunteer as a fourth.

I love Clark Brewster.  He represented Rico Yarbrough. He tried everything to get him accuited. He almost got thrown in jail for contempt of court on two occassions during the trial.  In the end,  he just couldn't overcome the recorded phone conversations. When he gets really mad in court, he moves his head back and forth and he looks kind of like a rooster.

Louis Bullock isn't as good as Brewster. He really just goes after the deep pockets. I don't think the city could afford him to investigate anything.

I haven't had any dealings with Greg Bledsoe.

These were all funny picks but I am still curious who you think would be "independent" and could do an thorough investigation?

Oh, maybe a Citizens Committee, made up of those names I mentioned, plus some other men and women of good character and intelligence who are INDEPENDENT of the police force.  Former judges, attorneys, accountants, clergy who had the time to spend evaluating whether the police killing was justified.

THEY, not the police would evaluate the evidence.  

And, if wrongdoing was suspected, make a referral to OSBI for further investigation, and then to the State Attorney General if confirmed.  

Not handed over to the local facile D.A., who already works hand-in-glove with the TPD, and rubber-stamps every TPD investigation of a police killing.

The police simply are NOT independent to investigate themselves.  Ever.

[guido911]

Have you guys seen those bastard police officers out helping those allegedly suffering from this storm. Just look at them, "pretending" to care about Tulsa citizens and "pretending" to tolerate the freezing temperatures and rain and slick streets while more likely than not their own families are without power. I saw a couple of police officers helping a stranded motorist near a downed power line. No doubt the police staged that potentially life-threatening scene to appear as if they are heroic. Sorry, I did not have my digital camera to record the latter event. No one on this thread would beileve it.  Hey, here's a thought, let's hire three plaintiff lawyers or form a Citizens Commission to handle this weather disaster. I bet those folks would brave the temperature and dangerous conditions to make a difference in this world.

[Breadburner]

I saw them in Home Depot for crowd control when the generator shipment arrived.....heh...

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by guido911

Have you guys seen those bastard police officers out helping those allegedly suffering from this storm. Just look at them, "pretending" to care about Tulsa citizens and "pretending" to tolerate the freezing temperatures and rain and slick streets while more likely than not their own families are without power. I saw a couple of police officers helping a stranded motorist near a downed power line. No doubt the police staged that potentially life-threatening scene to appear as if they are heroic. Sorry, I did not have my digital camera to record the latter event. No one on this thread would beileve it.  Hey, here's a thought, let's hire three plaintiff lawyers or form a Citizens Commission to handle this weather disaster. I bet those folks would brave the temperature and dangerous conditions to make a difference in this world.

Excellent time for TPD to get mucho Overtime.

[TeeDub]

I am sure it is definitely a case of a few good apples spoils the bunch.  

The problem has always been there are those few people who wanted to be bullies in school, but were too small...    Now they have badges.

Lucky for us, those people don't tend to gravitate towards larger cities with more oversight.

[tulsa_fan]

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear
Excellent time for TPD to get mucho Overtime.

I'll pay you my husband's overtime so he can come back and help me with our one year old and two year old, we are staying with friend's who thankfully have power, it's the third place we've been in three days.  No one else I know does.  You know, they have families too.  Such ungrateful people, at least ***** about something that is worth it.  This isn't even topic!