Downtown Stadium Plan by May 30th

[perspicuity85]

This is step one in bringing the Drillers downtown.  Nothing more, nothing less.  Inteller, you may be right, this could be a classic example of Tulsa-style bull****.  But, I doubt Lamson would forego the possibility of negotiating with the Jenks developers for four months if he didn't at least want to make the downtown plan work, or more importantly, see the potential for profitability in a downtown stadium.  There's no reason to jump to conclusions.  Tulsa's juxtaposition of unfounded pessimism and unfounded optimism never ceases to amaze me.  

I think this is the perfect time for the corporate community to step up.  Amid a possible recession, Tulsa's still-prevalent energy companies stand a unique chance to profit.  Now would be a good time for them to stimulate the local community by investing in an East End stadium village project.

[dayzella]

The boss has a theory that the private funding is an already involved angel investor from a Tulsa blueblood/red clay family.


I'm not sure if she's in the know on that one, or just engaging in wishful thinking.

[Gaspar]

Wow! This sounds like desperation!

[Renaissance]

In case there was any question, it WAS desperation, but it's now a plan.  That doesn't make it a bad thing.  It is what it is.

Unless the City of Tulsa came up with something (anything) concrete, the Drillers were gone, daddy, gone to Jenks.  This was enough to hold that thought and give Tulsa more time to come up with something concrete.

I hoped for something more solid.  But if this is enough to hold Chuck for four more months while gathering public support, so be it.  Whatever works.

[Gaspar]

Anyone have a copy of the site-plan.  I'm looking at the site mentioned and I can't see how it all would fit.  Are they going to have parking on-site?

[brunoflipper]

she's already got the seed money...

read between the lines, this is not desperation... the may 30th date ties up the drillers until we get done with the street bond...

lamson really, really wants to be downtown...

i bet it starts somewhere around 2nd and runs down to 6th street... and there wont be a walmart anywhere close...

[TheArtist]

My instincts tell me that this has a decent chance of happening. One snag I can see may be the, " I hate downtown crowd joining up with the No Taxes of any sort crowd, combining and saying we can get a ballpark for free in Jenks" people spoiling any possible hotel tax increase if that has to be voted on. Though Tulsans per say wont be paying that hotel tax, the nay sayers wont care and will scream their lines of protest quite loudly.

[sgrizzle]

Taken from other thread:

[swake]

quote:Originally posted by brunoflipper

she's already got the seed money...

read between the lines, this is not desperation... the may 30th date ties up the drillers until we get done with the street bond...

lamson really, really wants to be downtown...

i bet it starts somewhere around 2nd and runs down to 6th street... and there wont be a walmart anywhere close...

I really hope you are right, but my head tells me otherwise.

[sgrizzle]

Anyone want to bet lunch? I'm like 0-2 and willing to bet lunch on this plan coming to fruition!

[Wilbur]

quote:Originally posted by TheArtist

My instincts tell me that this has a decent chance of happening. One snag I can see may be the, " I hate downtown crowd joining up with the No Taxes of any sort crowd, combining and saying we can get a ballpark for free in Jenks" people spoiling any possible hotel tax increase if that has to be voted on. Though Tulsans per say wont be paying that hotel tax, the nay sayers wont care and will scream their lines of protest quite loudly.

WE CAN GET A BALL PARK FOR FREE IN JENKS.  

And what exactly is wrong with that?  Why is it worse to have private enterprise pay for things?  Better then the 'taxpayers buy everything we don't need crowd' believing the government is the cure to all our ills.  Now the government is the cure to all our baseball needs as well.

But remember, the city is broke (how many times have we heard that lately) but we got a new city hall.  Now we need a baseball stadium.  Plus we'll be voting on new streets right after we vote on countless other projects because the city can't seem to figure out what we need.

Great priorities.

[sgrizzle]

I like how everyone suddenly thinks the Jenks ballpark is a done deal. No-one has put a billion dollars of private money into anything in Tulsa yet everyone assumes these people have the cash in hand and can make it happen.

If Tulsa can do it without any cost to the taxpayer then do it. There is no guarantee a Jenks ballpark would ever happen regardless of what Tulsa does.

[Renaissance]

quote:Originally posted by Wilbur

quote:Originally posted by TheArtist

My instincts tell me that this has a decent chance of happening. One snag I can see may be the, " I hate downtown crowd joining up with the No Taxes of any sort crowd, combining and saying we can get a ballpark for free in Jenks" people spoiling any possible hotel tax increase if that has to be voted on. Though Tulsans per say wont be paying that hotel tax, the nay sayers wont care and will scream their lines of protest quite loudly.

WE CAN GET A BALL PARK FOR FREE IN JENKS.  

And what exactly is wrong with that?  Why is it worse to have private enterprise pay for things?  Better then the 'taxpayers buy everything we don't need crowd' believing the government is the cure to all our ills.  Now the government is the cure to all our baseball needs as well.

But remember, the city is broke (how many times have we heard that lately) but we got a new city hall.  Now we need a baseball stadium.  Plus we'll be voting on new streets right after we vote on countless other projects because the city can't seem to figure out what we need.

Great priorities.

Knock knock.  Who's there?

A QUARTER OF A BILLION DOLLAR SUBSIDY.

The Jenks river development is made possible by a $282 million TIF.  Now, what were you saying about private enterprise?

These things don't happen without public help.  If you don't care whether they happen or not, then butt out.  I like baseball.  I like urban areas.  I like them together.  

Further, there's no "we."  I will reiterate that the suburbs, Jenks specifically, are sucking life out of the city core.  This is fueled by specific enmity from suburbanites toward the city core they left behind.  If you don't think this phenomenon exists, just go visit the Tulsa World's website and see all the disparaging comments left by citizens of Jenks, Bixby, Sapulpa, and Owasso towards this stadium idea.  It's none of their business, either, but they appear to believe they have a vested interest in kicking the city while it's down.  Apparently a crappy inner city validates their bland, "safe," suburban existence.

Finally, every time these city-hating suburbanites snag another attraction from the city core, it costs the city in terms of population loss, tax loss, and quality of life.  The worse the quality of life in the city center, the more people and jobs leave.  

A vital core is imperative for a healthy city.  A baseball stadium has been shown over and over to contribute to the vitality of downtowns.  Say what you will about other options, but a new ballpark is a relatively small investment and is always a home run.

It's going to cost less than the new city hall and bring hundreds of thousands of people to the center of town, a center in which the municipality has invested billions.  Is it fiscally conservative to allow these billions to go to waste?  No.

[Kenosha]

1) There is 40 million set aside in that TIF for a   sports facility of some kind...Why does it have to be a baseball stadium? (Rufneck?  Where aaaarrrre you?)

2) I don't think the stadium is a dealbreaker for the River project in Jenks.  Especially if you look at their location of the stadium.  They obviously could have integrated it into the development concept more completely, but to me it looks as if you could just wipe it off the plan and still progress with a pretty amazing development.

3) I think Chuck Lamson would prefer to be downtown if they can make it work, otherwise the  trigger would have already been pulled.

[Chicken Little]

quote:Originally posted by Wilbur

FOR FREE

Nothing's free.  Like Floyd said.