Oklahoma has the lowest taxes in the nation again!

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by Hometown

Lowest taxes?

Maybe that's why we have the look and feel of a third world country.  The rest of the U.S. (at least the part that counts) has left us behind.

Even our dedicated strivers don't make a lot of money (with the exception of a few oil men).

Does your partner ever get tired of your incessant complaining, or are you a matched pair? [}:)]

[cannon_fodder]

Keep in mind Arkansas is 13th highest in the nation.  Nebraska 9th. Kansas is 15th. Mississippi is 29th.  There are states that I wouldn't want to particularly live in that have relatively high.

Make sure to avoid the low taxation states that dwell with us towards the bottom of Delaware, New Hampshire, New Mexico, Florida and Oregon.  Those are known to be horribly regressive state's that everyone else has left behind.  Well, everyone that matters.

If you want hire taxes you could move a few miles East to super liberal progressive and awesome to live in Arkansas.  Or A little North to Kansas.  Or jump South to Texas.  Plenty of options, yet you remain.  For that matter, feel free to donate extra money to help make Oklahoma a better place.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxdata/show/335.html

[sauerkraut]

Oklahoma has cheap prop. taxes, but sales taxes are high. Oklahoma also taxes food most states don't tax food. vehicle license registration is a bit high in Oklahoma, but gas taxes are some of the lowest around. Oklahoma's income taxes are a bit high, but cost of living is lower... All in all alot of it comes out in the wash and evens out. it depends on your life style and what you spend your money on and the car you buy and the house you live in.

[sauerkraut]

Texas has no income tax- but prop. taxes are thru the roof. So it all depends on if you work or are retired- own your home, or rent, on how much tax you'll pay in Texas.

[cannon_fodder]

quote:Originally posted by sauerkraut

Texas has no income tax- but prop. taxes are thru the roof. So it all depends on if you work or are retired- own your home, or rent, on how much tax you'll pay in Texas.

Property taxes are paid by renters at the end of the day.

[Chicken Little]

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

You can also say the State and Local Tax Burden is higher than it's ever been. (11.0%)

Same for the Federal Tax Burden. (21.7%)

If 33% of one's income isn't enough, I doubt anything will satisfy those who want more.

And, please, try to keep in mind, percentages mean revenues grow with income and costs.

I think you are looking at the wrong columns.  OK's State and Local Tax Burden is 9%, and it has been as high as 10%(1998).  It's two full points lower than the national average That's 18% lower than the national average.

Similar with the national...we pay 18.8% today and it has been as high as 22.3%(1981).  The national average is 21.7%

So, our state and local tax burden is not at an all-time high...that was 30.4% in 1981.  We are currently at 27.8%.  Oklahoma's total tax burden is 8.6% lower than it was in '81, and 15% lower than the current national average.

There, aren't ya happy I saved you all that money?[]

[Wrinkle]

quote:Originally posted by Chicken Little

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

You can also say the State and Local Tax Burden is higher than it's ever been. (11.0%)

Same for the Federal Tax Burden. (21.7%)

If 33% of one's income isn't enough, I doubt anything will satisfy those who want more.

And, please, try to keep in mind, percentages mean revenues grow with income and costs.

I think you are looking at the wrong columns.  OK's State and Local Tax Burden is 9%, and it has been as high as 10%(1998).  It's two full points lower than the national average That's 18% lower than the national average.

Similar with the national...we pay 18.8% today and it has been as high as 22.3%(1981).  The national average is 21.7%

So, our state and local tax burden is not at an all-time high...that was 30.4% in 1981.  We are currently at 27.8%.  Oklahoma's total tax burden is 8.6% lower than it was in '81, and 15% lower than the current national average.

There, aren't ya happy I saved you all that money?[]

I stand corrected.
The vertical banding and ambiguous titles on the chart was messing with me. (or was it I with it?)

But, percentage-based taxes still grow with the economy and with real expansion (jobs/companies).

"Bigger piece of the Pie" really means your remaing pie is of less volume, when what is needed is more pies.

[Chicken Little]

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

I stand corrected.
The vertical banding and ambiguous titles on the chart was messing with me. (or was it I with it?)

But, percentage-based taxes still grow with the economy and with real expansion (jobs/companies).

"Bigger piece of the Pie" really means your remaing pie is of less volume, when what is needed is more pies.

Not sure I follow the last sentence, but yes, tax collections will grow and shrink proportionally with the economy.  And, as others have shown in this thread, government is a part of the economy, too.

But what I want to know is, are you 8.6% happier   than you were in 1981?  Are you 15% happier than the average American?  Our taxes are the lowest in the nation...again.  It's like you one won the Superbowl for the second straight year.  Where's the celebration?  In BBall terms, Oklahoma has made it to the Elite Eight every year since 1986, that's 21 years in a row.  What have we got to show for this dynastic dominance?

Worn out and neglected infrastructure?  Low-wage jobs?  Oklahoma proves that having low, low taxes doesn't net you jack sh*t.  I don't want higher taxes, but I certainly don't fear doing what it takes to keep our infrastructure from crumbling any further.  If you want a future for yourselves and your children, you should save and invest...any smart Republican will tell you that.  To me, paying taxes is the way we invest in things that we share, like roads, schools, etc.

You guys have some very valid points about efficiency and managing the size of the bureaucracy, but you also have some fundamental problems understanding what taxes are really for.  

[cannon_fodder]

CL, I have no doubt that higher taxes could bennefit the state.

However, they will only bennefit the state more than leaving the money with the people if it used wisely.  Looking around at the mass of government waste, the multi layered bureaucracy, inefficiency, and entire programs that seem meaningless - I hope you understand why I don't think more taxes will equal prosperity.  In general, people take better care of their money than someone else would.

What's more, there is only so much money in the state.  It can be spent by the individuals or pillaged by the government.  Expenditures of either (to some extent) in state will fund jobs, development, and additional tax revenue.  

Show me a program I think is for the greater good and financed, constructed and operated in an efficient and meaningful manner and I'll vote to fund it.  But raising taxes for more entitlements, to throw more money at failing schools, or for regional pet projects is a losing battle.  The closer to home taxes are, the better.

/ramble

[EricP]

(snip)

quote:  The closer to home taxes are, the better.

I will actually agree on that one. Our state can't declare war on other countries, so that makes it immediately able to better spend our tax dollars

[TheArtist]

quote:Originally posted by EricP

(snip)

quote:  The closer to home taxes are, the better.

I will actually agree on that one. Our state can't declare war on other countries, so that makes it immediately able to better spend our tax dollars

I think we should go a step further and not send any of our taxes to OKC. Why send it there so they can pay people to "do lord knows what" then send it back? Leave out the middle man and we would have more taxes to spend here. I do think we need taxes for things like roads, schools, police, parks, or whatever our community gets together and decides we want to do. But the key is OUR taxes OUR community. Perhaps send a bit to a state collective for emergencies because a city can run into a hard patch or have an emergency they cant afford, plus a state highway fund, but more than that I cant see.

[sauerkraut]

A good place to live & work is Vancover, Washington. The state of Washington has no income tax. Across the river in Portland, Oregon they have no sales tax. So you can have the best of both worlds if ya live there. Live/Work in the state of Washington pay no income taxes, shop in Portland, OR. and pay no slaes tax at all.[]

[Hometown]

Can we all agree there is no such thing as a free lunch?

What really worries me is the time when the bill comes due for the decades of neglect.  I don't want to get stuck with cumulative bill for Oklahoma's chronic negligence.

I have started to suspect that the State of Oklahoma played a role that contributed to and helped lead to the Okie migration.  All I recall from old newsreels was talk about bank repossession of farms and the over farming of the land but I have come to wonder if the state didn't somehow contribute to the migration either actively through wrong head policies or through neglect.  I do find that people and entities are consistent and over time patterns emerge.  

This is real question for those knowledgeable about Oklahoma history:  Did the State of Oklahoma help cause the Okie Migration?

[bokworker]

Are you suggesting that the State somehow controlled the weather? Certainly there were improvements made to the farming techniques of the day, i.e. terracing fields and planting of tree lines to reduce windblown erosion, but the overriding factor that lead to the "Oklahoma migration" was the extended drought conditions. Both of my parent grew up as "dirt farmers", actually wheat farmers but there were more years of dirt than wheat, in western Oklahoma and I don't believe I have ever heard them make any statement to the effect that the state played any part in their success or failure.

Interestingly the tree lines are still there.

[Hometown]

No, my question is, outside of weather did the state have any policy that contributed to the Okie Migration?  

I'm not clear on this but aren't some banks state banks that are regulated by the state?  So my question also asks did the state banks play any role that contributed to the Okie migration?

I'm just curious if the state played any role that contributed to the Okie migration, even if it was just gross neglect?