Brookside: Upscale Apartment Complex Proposal

[Townsend]

quote:Originally posted by spoonbill

Don't get too upset yet.  

There is still a project that will emerge from this.  Put your thinking caps on and lets interject some good ideas that can be passed on to the developer that is looking for a pick up game on this site.

Now it is more exciting because the ground work has been done and now someone is going to take over who will be open to your input!!!

And. . . This was your opportunity to see where, and how projects actually die in Tulsa, rather than your usual conjecture.  Bombasada is only one of several out of town developers that have been roaming our city looking for fodder (not you CF).  Now that they have been shafted, others are reluctant to engage.

We have plenty of local developers who are willing and able to play within our broken and retarded system to get things done.  We just have to tell them what we want, and this project did exactly that.  Now lets give them incentive to continue.

Wouldn't "incentive to continue" be to change our retarded system?

It blows my mind that it's allowed to happen.  Where did these rules come from?  Too many questions in my head and too many frustrations  to write them.

[Gaspar]

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder

quote: Looks like the person CF contacted passed on the "official status" rather than the real one.

John Gilbert was the person I contacted.  I got the word from Becky Perry who told me she "spoke to John [Gilbert] and he said the project is still moving forward."

Thanks for lying to me when I was trying to quell a "rumor" for you.
- - -

Aside from my angst at being lied to, this pisses me off.  If it is part of the "international building code" why did this exact same group build in a dozen other cities and not have the same issues?

Commercial sprinklers in a residential complex?

Building in segments?

What the hell are they talking about.

THIS is the lack of leadership we talk about when we complain that Tulsa is stuck.  A $40,000,000 unsolicited development walks in and knocks on your door.  We chase them away.  Don't worry, there is plenty of land in Bixby to build new apartments.

Sometimes I really hate this town.

Tulsa is still under the old IBC 2003 Code that would sprinklers for this type of use.
 
I don't know if the new IBC 2007 code does? Nor do I know what code they designed the building for.

As for segmentation of the buildings?  I think that's just necessary to make it look like the rest of Tulsa's crappy apartment complexes.  No clue?

[tulsa1603]

I smell something fishy here....

The cost of segmenting the building and the additional cost of commercial vs. residential sprinklers, would have been but a HICCUP in a $40 million project...and are definitely something that would be expected in a project this large.  Any city is going to require this, and if this development group says otherwise, they're lying.

Then the article ends with:

"Gilbert said the Bomasada Group doesn't currently have any other projects in mind for Tulsa, but said, "We're still snooping around" for a place to develop within the city. "

Now, the fire marshal and building codes will apply no matter where they build in the city of Tulsa...so if the fire marshall and/or building code is the problem, why are they continuing to look at land within the city?? [?]

I think they're trying to generate some publicity or something...

[sgrizzle]

Maybe their margins were tight, they tested the waters here and will look at building a taller development elsewhere. 6,7,8 stories?

[Gaspar]

quote:Originally posted by tulsa1603

I smell something fishy here....

The cost of segmenting the building and the additional cost of commercial vs. residential sprinklers, would have been but a HICCUP in a $40 million project...and are definitely something that would be expected in a project this large.  Any city is going to require this, and if this development group says otherwise, they're lying.

Then the article ends with:

"Gilbert said the Bomasada Group doesn't currently have any other projects in mind for Tulsa, but said, "We're still snooping around" for a place to develop within the city. "

Now, the fire marshal and building codes will apply no matter where they build in the city of Tulsa...so if the fire marshall and/or building code is the problem, why are they continuing to look at land within the city?? [?]

I think they're trying to generate some publicity or something...

Sprinklers wouldn't be too much of an issue, but segmenting would be a complete redesign.  On a 40 million dollar project it would be around $2 million not including MEP or Structural engineering.

[tulsa1603]

quote:Originally posted by Gaspar

quote:Originally posted by tulsa1603

I smell something fishy here....

The cost of segmenting the building and the additional cost of commercial vs. residential sprinklers, would have been but a HICCUP in a $40 million project...and are definitely something that would be expected in a project this large.  Any city is going to require this, and if this development group says otherwise, they're lying.

Then the article ends with:

"Gilbert said the Bomasada Group doesn't currently have any other projects in mind for Tulsa, but said, "We're still snooping around" for a place to develop within the city. "

Now, the fire marshal and building codes will apply no matter where they build in the city of Tulsa...so if the fire marshall and/or building code is the problem, why are they continuing to look at land within the city?? [?]

I think they're trying to generate some publicity or something...

Sprinklers wouldn't be too much of an issue, but segmenting would be a complete redesign.  On a 40 million dollar project it would be around $2 million not including MEP or Structural engineering.

I'm an architect.  No way would this thing have been completely designed without researching codes FIRST.  Fire walls (I assume that is what they are talking about) are common.  This isn't some archaic rule that Tulsa has.  I don't think we're talking about unrealistic things here....there is something weird about the reasons given.  Two days ago they told CF that the project was on.  Now it's off?  How have they had time to figure out how much a redesign would cost?  It seems shady to me that some firm blows into town, promises a $40million project, then pulls out whenever they meet any resistance - then all the blame is placed at the feet of the city.  These rules aren't any more complicated than anywhere else.  If anything, Tulsa is an EASY place to build.

[TheArtist]

After the meeting the developer had, I and a couple others hung around and spoke with him. One thing he said, that he probably wouldnt have said to the public in general added to my general impression that they were really pushing things cost wise with this development anyway. Tulsa is still not the best market for something like this development. The cost of having parking underneath means your profit margins are already going to be lower, plus putting in details like granite counter tops a lot of stone on the exterior, etc. again raises the price. But.... what the developer mentioned was that he was hoping to be able to add the rooms he took off on either end in order to make some decent money on the deal. Both ends of the development were cut down to 4 stories to try and appease the neighbors and get the initial approval. I suppose he hoped he could then go ahead later and get approval to add the extra apartments. It could have been that he realized that wasnt going to be allowed to happen.

Even if everything went smoothly, my impression from the beginning was that this development was really a stretch for the area and the developer knew he was pushing his profit margins and luck a bit. Once even a few more obstackles and challenges reared their heads, he probably got cold feet and backed out. I just dont think Tulsa quite has the market for something like this yet. I really wish it did, but wishing doesnt make it so.

The cost of the property, the constraints of the property, the cost of building the development all combined with the still "iffieness" of the market here, probably gave the developer a lot of pause.

Perhaps if he finds some land at a better price, is able to build the number of units he needs for the type of developments he builds, he will try again.

As for some other developer doing something similar in the area.  He mentioned that because of the costs and constraints you faced with this property the most reasonable development options would be to either build a class A type development similar to what he was proposing, or a class C development. Class C, super cheap construction and pack em in. Someone from the group that is doing the new development on the other side of 41st there stood up later and mentioned that they had considered that property, had crunched the numbers, and also came to that same conclusion. In order to make a profit there you would have to either do high end/high density, or low end cheap construction. The current zoning there makes it difficult to build something high end with enough density, while still being affordable for the Tulsa market.

I wonder if Perrys logic will then hold true. The area will become more desirable and thus the property itself will command more price. The property is zoned residential, "dont know if mixed use is available there?" But the more the property rises, unless the market goes up, aka the people who can afford to pay more for a high end apartment, the demand goes up, it means that whatever you build there will cost more, you will have to charge more. If you build high end that costs ever more, you have to be sure that you have the people who can and will pay that premium. Otherwise you will have to build more cheaply and charge more, and hope that the market will go for that. With the height restrictions, it appears to me that it will only become more difficult to build high quality apartments in the area as the property goes up in value? It only works if you have the people willing to pay even more and I am sure market research and demographic studies can determine if the market has enough demand. Why pay for this expensive apartment when you can pay half for the same amount of space in basically the same area for a cheaper apartment or even a home? There are still plenty of very cheap apartments and even homes, right around the corner to compete with. So obviously that area isnt as desirable as its made out to be. You may have high end amenities, but at some point the market will balk... just like this developer did.

[spoonbill]

There are two kinds of developers that will be/are looking at the property.  One wants to rip out as much profit as possible as quickly as possible and move on.  The other wants to build quality, with quality materials and take profit over a long period of time by retaining ownership and managing the property.

As players emerge, lets evaluate them by examining their past projects.  Dismiss promises and fancy drawings, they are no more than smoke, intended to calm the bees.

Artiest,  If the person you spoke with mentioned the option of class C he was simply trying to solidify his position as a top notch developer.  No class C garbage will be allowed here.  The other developers working on nearby projects will buy the land before they will let that happen.  

There will be a whole line of clown cars peeking in on this property now.  Evaluate the clowns based on their past projects.

[TulsaSooner]

This project is dead according to an article in today's Tulsa World.

Sorry if this was covered elswewhere.  [^]

[Townsend]

Preserve midtown FB'd the Bomasada group's filed a landscape plan with the city.

They're back?

[DTowner]

Preserve midtown FB'd the Bomasada group's filed a landscape plan with the city.

They're back?

The economy would seem to support a revival of this development.

[Townsend]

Preserve Midtown's latest FB post about this development:

BOMASADA PROJECT ARISES AGAIN!!
I was contacted by a KJRH reporter who is doing an interview with Jim Gibson from the Brookside Bomasada development who assures the reporter that they are going ahead with this project now.
It seems, along with financing problems, they had to reapply for new construction permits because the originals had expired and now are ready to go.
This has been a very stressful process for the surrounding residents who have many issues with this project and its numerous impacts on the surrounding neighborhood quality of life issues.
You cannot blame these people for being weary with the on again, off again process they have endured.
Right now, a park would be a much better use for the neigborhood residents.
One BIG question is does this project adhere to the established Brookside Plan for this region. Its size alone tells us it does not!

Read this previous article from 2008 for reference.
BATESLINE Article in 2008:
Council to consider Bomasada in Brookside
By Michael Bates on July 16, 2008 10:27 PM

Thursday night the Tulsa City Council will consider a rezoning application for a block-sized, four-story apartment building at 39th and Rockford, in the area designated as residential in the Brookside Infill Plan, which has been incorporated into the City's Comprehensive Plan.

(This should be a link to the Council's "backup packet" for the Bomasada rezoning, but it's not. This is the second time a link from the Council's online agenda has led to the wrong material on this particular item -- it happened when the zoning request appeared before the Council Urban and Economic Development Committee. We need legislation that gives online public information the same importance as info posted on the bulletin board outside City Hall or in the legal notices in the paper. If the complete information isn't posted, the agenda item can't move ahead.. As it is, it's too easy to conveniently make a mistake and avoid making public info as available as it should be.)

My "op/ed extra" column this week in Urban Tulsa Weekly was about the proposed apartment superblock, which is a test of the Council's willingness to adhere to the Brookside plan and the credibility of all citizen participation in land-use planning, a salient question as we approach citywide planning workshops in September for our new Comprehensive Plan:

Whether you live in Brookside or not, all Tulsa property owners have a stake in the outcome, as it will show whether this City Council will stick with or set aside the development standards that were negotiated by homeowners, business owners, and developers and formally adopted by the city. Consistent application of the rules is the issue at hand....
In conducting in-depth interviews for Tulsa's new comprehensive planning effort, the public opinion research firm Collective Strength found a recurring theme: "Fatalism about lack of zoning and code enforcement and special favors for the wealthy." Approval of this development would only reinforce that well-founded cynicism and would undermine optimism that a new comprehensive plan would be fairly applied to all.

Brookside plan participants put in a great deal of time and effort. To set the product of that effort aside will chill enthusiasm for participating in future planning efforts. If all that negotiation and compromise comes to nothing, if the developer is always going to get his way, why bother?...

The ripples from their decision will extend far beyond Brookside. The new comprehensive planning effort, PLANiTULSA, will have its first public workshops in September.

If the council shows respect for the Brookside planning process by voting down the Bomasada development, it will signal to the public that they can have a positive and long-lasting impact by participating in PLANiTULSA.

If they set the Brookside plan aside for the developers, it will feed public cynicism about public land use planning and discourage participation from the very activists who have the most insight to contribute to the new plan.

Choose wisely, Councilors.
Brookside neighborhood advocate Laura Collins sets out the sound planning case against the Bomasada development. (I've added emphasis here and there.)

TO THE COUNCIL: The Village of Brookside Neighbors immediately surrounding 39th and Rockford, as well as Brooksiders in the area and other citizens of Tulsa who are friends of Brookside and have an interest in the precedent this proposal presents are in support of redevelopment as long as it is appropriate to the individual neighborhood. The Brookside Infill Task Force Redevelopment Restrictions specify the scale, rhythm, height and (width) open space requirements for redevelopment. We welcome Bomasada to present a design of dwelling which is compatible with these guidelines. Some would like to portray us as "anti-progress" or "against development". Nothing could be further from the truth. We have watched the subject property continue to decline under the ownership of Perry Properties and have wondered why the city, if feeling now that it is such a "blight" -- as was described by Roy Johnson and at least two of the TMAPC panelists during the May 21st hearing ----- which lasted nearly 10 hours!
POINTS OF CONCERN AND FACT:

The neighborhood infill restriction on height, for example is 35 feet. Bomasada asked for and recieved a variance on height of 48 feet, with a maximum of 49' 4" additional height in order to 'screen A/C units on roof". On the Rockford side, which they claim will be 35 feet, they were granted a setback variance of 16 feet (from the street) and an additional 3' 8" in height -- again for hiding the A/C units on roof. Why such a difference in additional height the two requests? Is the setback measured from the curb or the centerline? This would make the building way too close to the homes across the street. What is the city average or guideline for setbacks? How can a building this mammoth in scale look 'in scale' with the homes near it so close to the street?
Additionally, the Brookside Infill Plan clearly states that "monolithic forms that dominate area or disrupt vision should be avoided". This particular design chosen for Brookside is a clear example of everything the task force was attempting to prevent from being placed in Brookside . Again, how can this type of design look as though it is harmoniously 'in scale' with the one story homes across the street from it to the east?
1. Bomasada has numerous design models to choose from.... Our neighborhood association and petition group were not asked which design we felt fit our neighborhood. Bomasada V.P. chose it for us. It does not conform to the Infill Task Force Plan's restrictions on: Density, Scale, Open Space or Height. Most notably, it is a solid 'wall' of construction with very little if any visual break and negative space or green space as seen from the renderings provided us by the developer.

2. The infrastructure will not support this development without improvements. Will the city do this work now / during the development's construction or after the development has been in place? What is the cost to the city?

3. Are sidewalks planned around the perimeter of the property by the developer? Or are we really going to let them off the hook with a nominal waiver fee and make the city do it ten years from now? The neighbors do not want to wait 5-10 years for a sidewalk to be REPLACED.

4. Parking for the apartment -- for guests. At last hearing, they are providing 25-57 guest parking spaces for a 240 one and two bedroom apartments on three heavily traveled streets. Will parking be allowed on 39th or Rockford for guests? We hope not, as it will not be conducive to pedestrian safety.

5. Traffic study was not completed. How can we build without a plan for impact on neighboring streets and residential safety? Children walk to school (Eliot) and catch buses there -- while Rockford is already a busy street when school is open. What precautions will the city take to ensure the safety of neighborhood children? 4-way stops? Traffic signal at 41st and Rockford? Speed humps on Rockford? 39th? More police to catch speeders and stop sign runners?

6. Flood plain and environmental impact. Can we count on the city and the developer to avoid any increased stress on our storm water and sewer systems? Are they separate or combined systems?

7. Pedestrian-friendly access on and off the apartment property for the tenants into the Old Village Shopping Center? If not, why not? These are young professionals you are marketing to. Many of them will no doubt have bicycles and want this amenity.

8. We are generally disappointed with the lack of communication and respect shown us by the developer. Our inputwas really not sought out. There was never a specific meeting held for neighbors within 300 feet of the property by either the developer or the BNA. We therefore had to seek information, call for meetings, canvasse the area alone and in the end, we are portrayed by those in favor of this project (some members of the Brookside business community) as "anti-development" -- which couldn't be farther from the truth.

9. We look forward to redevelopment of this property. It obviously has not been properly maintained by the owner (Perry Properties) and the city was either unaware of the situation or never took any strong stand on enforcing the improvement of the property which the city now refers to as 'blight' at 39th and Rockford.

We have said all along ---- we look for a development from Bomasada that compliments our neighborhood design and is built within the zoning guidelines, taking into account safety and user-friendly priniciples and amenities for both the future enclave tenants and the surrounding homeowners and neighbors. All parties involved in the decision making process --- including our city leaders --- should feel a shared ownership of the neighborhood improvement project and forge a future partnership in goodwill, respect and teamwork ... embracing a shared vision for this amazing and very liveable section of the City of Tulsa.

We ask that our concerns for safety and the quality of life for our neighborhood residents already living in Brookside are remembered as you do the work of deciding to approve or disapprove, and work out the details of this new development positioned in one of Tulsa's most desirable and historic areas.

[swake]

Bomasada Brookside Construction LLC formed last month here in Oklahoma:
http://www.lookupbook.com/profile/construction-contractors/ok/tulsa/bomasada-brookside-construction-llc

Bomasada Tulsa LLC formed last month in Texas:
http://www.corporationwiki.com/Texas/Houston/bomasada-tulsa-llc/39013661.aspx

Looks like it's on like Donkey Kong.

[Townsend]

TW has grabbed the story.

Tweet:  Major Brookside apartment construction project revives http://bit.ly/MbY0ew

Major Brookside apartment construction project revives

After over three years of activity, plans for a large new apartment complex in Brookside are moving ahead.

Construction on the upscale, $33 million, 240-unit Enclave at Brookside should begin at its site on five acres at 1414 E. 39th St. within 30 to 45 days, said John Gilbert, Sr. Vice President of the Bomasasa Group of Houston.

The Enclave at Brookside was originally planned in 2008, though the economic crisis of that period caused the group's original financier to raise their equity requirements to unworkable levels, Gilbert said. As a result, the project stalled.

"Banks just weren't lending from January 2009 to January 2011," he said. "They were worried by the uncertainty in the markets."

But lending standards have eased somewhat, and Bomasada now has financing secured through Amegy Bank of Houston, as well as F&M Bank of Tulsa.

The group has resubmitted their construction plans to the city of Tulsa for permitting.

The details of the project have changed only slightly since the original proposal. There will be one three-story building, one four-story building and a parking structure in the back, Gilbert said.

The 240 units will have floor plans ranging from 724 square feet to 1,500 square feet, and rent for $900 to $2,000 per month.

Gilbert said the floorplans have changed slightly, with more open designs and islands in the kitchens.

"In the past four years, living trends have changed a little," he said.

The facility will also have a clubhouse with a fitness center, as well as a "resort-style" swimming pool.

Bomasada had demolished two existing apartment complexes on the site in 2008 and had installed some of the infrastructure before the project ground to a halt.

Despite the setback, Gilbert said Bomasada officials never felt that scaling back or abandoning their first construction project in Tulsa would be an option.

"We think the Brookside area is the best in the city," he said. "It's eclectic, it's close to the river, and it's walkable."


Read more from this Tulsa World article at http://www.tulsaworld.com/business/article.aspx?subjectid=32&articleid=20120801_32_0_Aftero93070

[erfalf]

I recall hearing about this several years ago and all these people were throwing hissy fits. What is the big freaking deal. Aren't these going to be high-end apartments? Didn't they tear down some fairly slummy looking apartments/houses? How is this detrimental to the neighborhood considering it sits basically right on a busy intersection at 41st & Peoria? Is it just the height?