Big River Dig

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by Vision 2025

quote:Originally posted by carltonplace

I was amazed by how much sand has filled in above the low water dam. Wonder how much it will cost to scoop it out of there.

Don't really intend to scoup it out, rather the plan is to modify the dam (engineering selection is presently underway) to pass it on downstream as it will just accumulate again.

Kirby, what is the reasoning for there no longer being dredging operations north of the 23rd St. bridge?  They ran sand dredges there for ages and I was thinking even after the LWD was put in at 31st.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by citizen72

quote:Originally posted by carltonplace

I was amazed by how much sand has filled in above the low water dam. Wonder how much it will cost to scoop it out of there.

That was to be an obvious from the very beginning, but Mayor Inhofe in his above all judgment kept saying over and over again it was self cleaning. Yeah right. It used to be called, "Inhofe's folly."

I doubt Inhofe was responsible for the engineering on the project and was going off of what the project engineers had told the city.

I do realize there were some things about the Zink Lake project which were questionable judgement on Inhofe's part, but I don't think this was one which points directly to him.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

Remember during the "put water in the river" campaign when the river was dry?

The news story at the time said they were doing Zink Dam seal work.

And, this mornings' TW says they're NOT able to do seal work due to the water level not being low enough.

I know, I'm pretty much always confused, but this doesn't help.

They dried it out some months ago to inspect the dam.

[citizen72]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

quote:Originally posted by citizen72

quote:Originally posted by carltonplace

I was amazed by how much sand has filled in above the low water dam. Wonder how much it will cost to scoop it out of there.

That was to be an obvious from the very beginning, but Mayor Inhofe in his above all judgment kept saying over and over again it was self cleaning. Yeah right. It used to be called, "Inhofe's folly."

I doubt Inhofe was responsible for the engineering on the project and was going off of what the project engineers had told the city.

I do realize there were some things about the Zink Lake project which were questionable judgement on Inhofe's part, but I don't think this was one which points directly to him.

From my viewpoint having been involved I have to say it was definitely his responsibility. It had to be his way or there was going to be hell to pay. He was told by the engineers that it would fill with sand. His response was we will just scope it out. Yes it has his name on it big time.

[Vision 2025]

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

Remember during the "put water in the river" campaign when the river was dry?

The news story at the time said they were doing Zink Dam seal work.

And, this mornings' TW says they're NOT able to do seal work due to the water level not being low enough.

I know, I'm pretty much always confused, but this doesn't help.

The previous attempt (by PSO and RPA) was canceled when the river flows came up following the long dry run of the previous season.  This most recent dry up was coordinated by the Corps to accommodate a weeks worth of maintenance work, (we understand at Keystone). The Corps also requested assistance from Tulsa County was able to grub and reshape the lower island.  As for the gate seals RPA and PSO were ready however the flow never dropped sufficiently to make the seal repairs... the lowest it ever got was 6" through the gates with all three down the entire time.... just to much local inflow between here and Zink and Keystone.

[Vision 2025]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

quote:Originally posted by Vision 2025

quote:Originally posted by carltonplace

I was amazed by how much sand has filled in above the low water dam. Wonder how much it will cost to scoop it out of there.

Don't really intend to scoup it out, rather the plan is to modify the dam (engineering selection is presently underway) to pass it on downstream as it will just accumulate again.

Kirby, what is the reasoning for there no longer being dredging operations north of the 23rd St. bridge?  They ran sand dredges there for ages and I was thinking even after the LWD was put in at 31st.

Dredging at Zink

1. The little dredge purchased after Zink was constructed was damaged in a storm, flipped over as I recall.  The only good it ever did was when Tulsa County used it to clean out the par 3 lake at LaFortune Park...
2.  The sand depth to rock is not really sufficient for a good dredging operation; you need a hole or a deep bar to dredge effectively.
3.  For commercial use, there is insufficient processing area nearby, the raw sand would have to be trucked to where it could be processed... double to triple handling compared to regular commercial sand operations = $$$
4.  Lastly, poor sand quality for today's market (too uniform a gradation and small fines content)... I suspect this plus number 2 may be why sand mining operations stopped at the 23rd street batch plant area more than 30 years ago.

Kirby

[Vision 2025]

quote:Originally posted by citizen72

Why don't they rip-rap the perimeter of the island while they are at it. Sand is very mobile and they will just have to do it again and again. Rip-rap above the normal water line and it will really help.

Good question.  However; the issue being addressed by the County, for the Corps, is not really one of sand migration from the island tops as much as it is one of vegetation removal, the sand was being pushed from the surrounding area as a way to deepen the water adjacent to the island so as to hopefully stop 4 legged predators from converting nesting terns into a scooby snack.

[TheArtist]

I find it interesting that they ever really used that area for sand dredging. The sand isnt that deep, the bare bedrock can be seen in many places. The shore is mostly sand in many places, less so upstream, but there is a lot more sand in places in southern parts of Tulsa. The river is narrower and faster near downtown, and wider and slower out south, thus its more likely to drop sand there.  Probably was convenient in early years and you could get enough to make it worthwhile. But now with the shoreline mostly "locked in" and better sandy areas out south, the sand in Zink lake will mostly be from siltation. A lot of upstream silt is now trapped in Keystone lake.  Again, its not that far down to bedrock and once you scrape up what you can, your done till it builds up again. Dont know how long it takes to silt up?