(PROJECT) QT Park - 41st & Riverside

[perspicuity85]

I've always thought that area is a good location for water taxis.  The absence of a vehicular bridge doesn't mean there can't be a connection between both sides of the river.  I would like to see water taxis or small ferries run between the Riverview area, the Riverwest Festival Park, and the 41st St. park.  Maybe it could be a private enterprise- partially financed by potential developers of Riverside projects (i.e. Branson Landing group).

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by perspicuity85

I've always thought that area is a good location for water taxis.  The absence of a vehicular bridge doesn't mean there can't be a connection between both sides of the river.  I would like to see water taxis or small ferries run between the Riverview area, the Riverwest Festival Park, and the 41st St. park.  Maybe it could be a private enterprise- partially financed by potential developers of Riverside projects (i.e. Branson Landing group).

Unless you build a lock, your water taxis would have to be able to fly.

[Double A]

If it prevents the bridge, that has long been on the long range planning for the city, I would prefer they keep their generous contribution. We need that bridge much more.

[TheArtist]

Good catch on the bridge thing. I had forgotten about that. It really makes one suspicious that he got some kind of assurances, wink wink nod nod, that there wasnt going to be a bridge there (at least certainly not aaany time soon) from someone or the park would likely have been shifted off to one side. I guess we now know where the idea of a bridge going there stands. Aint gonna happen for at least 20-30 years or so.

[sgrizzle]

It looks like the river is a little narrower to the north and the west bank at 36th-38th is city-owned land. The east bank around that area is much wider as well and more readily allow for a bridge to be built.

Also, the original 41st street plans put the park largely on the north side of 41st and this puts all the new construction on the south side of 41st.

Just conjecture.

[TheArtist]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

It looks like the river is a little narrower to the north and the west bank at 36th-38th is city-owned land. The east bank around that area is much wider as well and more readily allow for a bridge to be built.

Also, the original 41st street plans put the park largely on the north side of 41st and this puts all the new construction on the south side of 41st.

Just conjecture.

But zeeesh that would make it a mess traffic wise. Versus just a stop light as you went across riverside, you would have to stop, turn right, then stop, then turn left. Same for people going east. So basically you would have a stop at 41st then one at the bridge and cars piled up in between. Or you would end up with added turn lanes and people trying to shift over several lanes before the bridge or 41st, then likely stopping in the middle of riverside waiting on oncoming traffic. Or they would have to do some sort of looptey-loops over riverside like 21st lol. No scenario looks pretty if the park remains where it is at. My best guess is still the "Someone has decided, No 41st bridge." scenario.

[YoungTulsan]

Maybe it was Sinclair putting another $1 billion into their refinery that made them think that area will fail to redevelop for another 30+ years.  I still think they could have good success in that area with a small buffer-zone between the refinery and 41st street.  41st from the River to US-75 and south is such prime land in my eyes.

[TheArtist]

quote:Originally posted by YoungTulsan

Maybe it was Sinclair putting another $1 billion into their refinery that made them think that area will fail to redevelop for another 30+ years.  I still think they could have good success in that area with a small buffer-zone between the refinery and 41st street.  41st from the River to US-75 and south is such prime land in my eyes.

Good point, I had thought of that when they announced their expansion as well.

I still say the best spot for river development on the west side is right across from downtown. But look how difficult that has been. My feeling is that when downtown and areas around it actually take off, show that Tulsa can grow that kind of urban development, that there is a good market for it... Then the area across the river will be looked at by developers more seriously. THEN after that area is solidly developed would there begin to be an added interest in bulding a bridge and making the area around 41st available for development.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by YoungTulsan

Maybe it was Sinclair putting another $1 billion into their refinery that made them think that area will fail to redevelop for another 30+ years.  I still think they could have good success in that area with a small buffer-zone between the refinery and 41st street.  41st from the River to US-75 and south is such prime land in my eyes.

There's almost a half mile between sinclair and 41st St. That's a decent buffer.

[swake]

Why is a bridge needed at 41st? Do westsiders even want a bridge there? Why is a bridge at 41st a good idea at all?

There's a bridge at 21st/23rd two mile north that is far from capacity. There's a six lane expressway bridge a mile south. The area right at 41st on the west bank is an ugly industrial area. There is a nice residential area on the other side of the industrial stuff but do the residents there want a lot more traffic coming through their area?  I don't have the impression that they feel cut off from the rest of the city or that they want 41st to become some sort of major arterial street with a lot of east-west traffic from the east side of the river. I think the quaint "out of the way" feeling of the area is part of its appeal and a bridge and a lot more traffic would ruin that feeling.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by swake

Why is a bridge needed at 41st? Do westsiders even want a bridge there? Why is a bridge at 41st a good idea at all?

There's a bridge at 21st/23rd two mile north that is far from capacity. There's a six lane expressway bridge a mile south. The area right at 41st on the west bank is an ugly industrial area. There is a nice residential area on the other side of the industrial stuff but do the residents there want a lot more traffic coming through their area?  I don't have the impression that they feel cut off from the rest of the city or that they want 41st to become some sort of major arterial street with a lot of east-west traffic from the east side of the river. I think the quaint "out of the way" feeling of the area is part of its appeal and a bridge and a lot more traffic would ruin that feeling.

Studies were done and yes many westsiders do want a bridge. A lot of people are taking the I-44 overpass now who might opt for the 41st bridge instead. A link between brookside and crystal city would be awesome. There are bridges at 21st and 11th which both carry over to almost the same spot. Both are north of any major non-industrial development. 41st, meanwhile, takes you to Ollie's, Crystal City/Red Fork, Berryhill, Prattville, TCC West Campus, etc.

[perspicuity85]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by perspicuity85

I've always thought that area is a good location for water taxis.  The absence of a vehicular bridge doesn't mean there can't be a connection between both sides of the river.  I would like to see water taxis or small ferries run between the Riverview area, the Riverwest Festival Park, and the 41st St. park.  Maybe it could be a private enterprise- partially financed by potential developers of Riverside projects (i.e. Branson Landing group).

Unless you build a lock, your water taxis would have to be able to fly.

Is there any type of boat at all that is well suited to carry passengers across the river in that area?

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by perspicuity85

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by perspicuity85

I've always thought that area is a good location for water taxis.  The absence of a vehicular bridge doesn't mean there can't be a connection between both sides of the river.  I would like to see water taxis or small ferries run between the Riverview area, the Riverwest Festival Park, and the 41st St. park.  Maybe it could be a private enterprise- partially financed by potential developers of Riverside projects (i.e. Branson Landing group).

Unless you build a lock, your water taxis would have to be able to fly.

Is there any type of boat at all that is well suited to carry passengers across the river in that area?

There are boats who can navigate the river, but they can't get over the low-water dam at 31st. It's a several foot drop.

[waterboy]

(exhale...). I operated a pontoon ferry boat/party boat on that stretch of the river in 2003. The first boat was an ugly duckling but the second season we prettied it up. We catered some dinner parties, did some kids birthday parties and tied it in with canoe and airboat rides upstream. Even with the shallow depth we found it feasible. Just ran out of support from local authorities and of course money. Ferried people across to the Oktoberfest (nearly 500 one night) 40 at a time. It was gruesome work as most were drunk and surprising cheap. They stiffed us on $5 rides! With some more time we would have made the alterations necessary to navigate the lake regularly. I had most every rock, and sand bar memorized in that area. I still harbor that dream. Just need the money.

There was some discussion about reworking the Zink low water dam to include a shallow wet ramp that a boat could cross over. That was part of the failed vote. A sluice I think they called it. But unless you want to rev up an airboat and fly across it at 50mph it is a barrier. Let me know....I'm game.

[PonderInc]

What did they do with Bell's Skyride?  That would be a fun way to cross the river...like jumping on a ski lift.  Or you could cross via zipline...